Currently in the UK there are adverts on the outside of buses questioning whether religion is socially unacceptable etc. (which it is)

One advert asks the question - "If there were a God - what one question would you ask him/her"

Any takers? What one question would you ask God ( if there was one)

Col

An old Benny Hill joke:

Having built the world's most powerful computer, they asked it "is there a God?"

After many, many calculations, the answer came out

"There is now!"

What is the theory of everything?

I guess if god gave me the answer, it wouldnt be a theory, would it? So, what is the law of everything?

I think the correct English should be:

If there were a God...should be...If there were a god

I guess if god gave me the answer...should be...I guess if God gave me the answer

Currently in the UK there are adverts on the outside of buses questioning whether religion is socially unacceptable etc. (which it is)How is religion socially unacceptable? Or are you talking about some(or many) of the things some(or many) people in some(or many) religions do (i.e. to other people), being socially unacceptable?

Any takers? What one question would you ask God ( if there was one)

When you had all of those people write the Bible, why did you have them include so many inconsistencies and contradictions? If you wanted people to follow 'your word' why not make it perfectly clear what that is and not leave it entirely open to interpretation?

Instead of throwing satan out of heaven why didn't you just melt his face?

My one question:

Why did you allow Mankind to start religion?

How is religion socially unacceptable? Or are you talking about some(or many) of the things some(or many) people in some(or many) religions do (i.e. to other people), being socially unacceptable?

Saying you are religious is now becoming socially unacceptable. Realistic people think religious people are freaks. Church attendance has dropped hugely in the UK. Saying you are religious is a bit like saying you shoot animals for sport, so naturally if you do both then you are really an outcast.

Religion is always associated with wars and violence, so naturally, normal people want to shun it.

Col

Glad I'm an athiest and that I only shoot animals for food... otherwise I'd be an outcast in Col's world.

My question to God (after my moment of "uh-oh") -
Why did you allow so much of man's inhumanity to man (Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, The Catholic Church, etc)?

Glad I'm an athiest and that I only shoot animals for food... otherwise I'd be an outcast in Col's world.

My question to God (after my moment of "uh-oh") -
Why did you allow so much of man's inhumanity to man (Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, The Catholic Church, etc)?
You left Bush off the list.........................

Saying you are religious is now becoming socially unacceptable. Realistic people think religious people are freaks. Church attendance has dropped hugely in the UK. Saying you are religious is a bit like saying you shoot animals for sport, so naturally if you do both then you are really an outcast.

Religion is always associated with wars and violence, so naturally, normal people want to shun it.

Col

I enjoyed this interview. Link (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7863517.stm)

It's suggested in the first part of the interview that creationism is actually becoming more popular in the UK.

"Please forgive me"

I think the correct English should be:

If there were a God...should be...If there were a god

I guess if god gave me the answer...should be...I guess if God gave me the answer

"I am Jack's complete lack of surprise."

what One Question Would You Ask God ( If There Was One)

Colis It Over Yet?

What one question would you ask God ( if there was one)

Col

Why did the chicken cross the road?

Why did the chicken cross the road?

Because the road was there before the chicken ( and the egg) :confused::p

...... the question - "If there were a God - what one question would you ask him/her"


Why did Yeshua ben Nazereth had brown eyes ?

Why did the chicken cross the road?

To save nine?

Because the road was there before the chicken ( and the egg) :confused::p
To save nine?

:D

Since my first question was answered by my fellow coolerites (?), I would like to ask God another question.

Could you briefly describe your major strengths and weaknesses?

Glad I'm an athiest and that I only shoot animals for food...

How positively prehistoric. Do you not have supermarkets and food shops where you live?

"What's for dinner dear?" - "Oh, I'll just go and shoot something then skin it and cook it - dinner will be ready in about two days"

Col

How positively prehistoric. Do you not have supermarkets and food shops where you live?

"What's for dinner dear?" - "Oh, I'll just go and shoot something then skin it and cook it - dinner will be ready in about two days"

Col

I guess if you actually pick an apple off a tree to eat, not only are you prehistoric, but definitely not a sinner since no god ever existed to forbid it in the first place. :D

No food shops or supermarkets here, unless you count Wal-Mart. It's cheaper to buy the ammo and hunt for food yourself. We also barter our goods at small market streets, including salt-dried meats and hand-picked nuts and fruits. You have to be careful of the red berries with the spines, they are poisonous. After dinner, we all dance around a huge fire chanting for rain to feed our crops. Then we beat our many wives with clubs and drag them by their hair to our caves.

That's not quite right -- red berries with spines are often edible.

That's not quite right -- red berries with spines are often edible.

Not the ones in our area. We use them for visions in moderation. Our village shaman is the only one able to eat them. Anyone else will die a horrible death, or so we're told.

Maybe the shaman is god... :confused:

Or maybe your shaman is a shamster... Be careful with the mushrooms, though...

You've got to believe in somthing.

I believe I'll have another drink.

my fellow coolerites ?

coolplebs ?



Could you briefly describe your major strengths and weaknesses?

strength : keep the earth rotating
weakness : need glasses since a week or two ;)

After dinner, we all dance around a huge fire chanting for rain to feed our crops.

Nice to see you keep some tradition of the original inhabitants you wiped out because you wanted their land.

Col

Nice to see you keep some tradition of the original inhabitants you wiped out because you wanted their land.

Col

Since you freely use the word "you" as if I or anyone else alive today were the ones who travelled here and slaughtered the original natives, shouldn't you actually refer to yourself and other Europeans? When the slaughter of the Native Americans started, the US didn't exist yet, it was done by the English, Spanish, and other Europeans, not "Americans".

For someone who preaches about facts (or conspiracy theories attacking the US), you sure are quick to assume that you know what ethnicity I actually belong to. For the record, I'm about 50% Native American, although my 2 grandparents (1 on each side) are from different "tribes", so I guess these traditions are actually partly my own. :cool:

For the record, I'm about 50% Native American, although my 2 grandparents (1 on each side) are from different "tribes", so I guess these traditions are actually partly my own. :cool:

Gosh, you are rare then. I thought anyone with native American genes was either a down-and-out or herded into a reservation and told to stay put and not upset the white men.

BTW - does having 2 native grandparents make you 50%? What about your parents? Or were you raised by wolves or bears like any true red indian seemed to be.

Col

coolplebs ?




Coolerics?

- what one question would you ask him/her"


Col

Would you end evil forever?

By the way Col,

You've degenerated over the years.

Seek happiness my friend, our days are numbered, we are not as young as once.

By the way Col,

You've degenerated over the years.

Seek happiness my friend, our days are numbered, we are not as young as once.

Degeneration is a by-product of getting older. The sooner they legalise euthanasia the better.

Col

Degeneration is a by-product of getting older. The sooner they legalise euthanasia the better.

Col

I think I've always been a bit of a degenerate, and as for dying at only 67 I hope I've got plenty of more years of annoying the kids ahead of me.

Brian

There have neen a number of good responses to the original question, couldn't find Col's tho'.
I think my reaction if God appeared would be "S%&t, do you mind if I go and change my trousers?"

Brian

There have neen a number of good responses to the original question, couldn't find Col's tho'.
I think my reaction if God appeared would be "S%&t, do you mind if I go and change my trousers?"

Brian

There has been some good comments.

I have several I would like to ask but can't decide on a main one.

Like

"Why did you make teeth hurt so much when one gets tootache?"

"How did you get Mary pregnant and why did Joseph accept it as normal?"

"Why do good people get crippling diseases whilst killers / rapists seem to be in good health?"

"Why did you bother to make all this / us and are you pleased the way it turned out?"

"If the big flood (that Noah and family were in) was to rid the world of sin and badness - where did it go wrong?"

Col

I have several I would like to ask but can't decide on a main one.

Col

That Col is the real problem, which of the many to choose.

Why if you can make all of this is your communication so bad?

Which is the correct faith?

Why if you can control the elements do you allow innocent people (children) to suffer from them?

If you are a Loving Father why do you allow your children to suffer?

Why are we all guilty of original sin?

What is the point of hell, it just seems to be vindictive revenge as those who end up there never believed, and it offers no solace to those that suffered at the hands of evil?

etc

Brian

Can the majority of souls that you love being destined to eternal suffering be considered a success/victory over evil?

Gosh, you are rare then. I thought anyone with native American genes was either a down-and-out or herded into a reservation and told to stay put and not upset the white men.

BTW - does having 2 native grandparents make you 50%? What about your parents? Or were you raised by wolves or bears like any true red indian seemed to be.

Col

Have no idea how the exact bloodline calculation would work out since certain percentages of DNA can come from either parent. I may have inherited less of the Native American genes.

I was raised by a combination of wolves and bears. I had the best of both worlds. :D

Instead of throwing satan out of heaven why didn't you just melt his face?

:D I'm still chuckling over this.

Have no idea how the exact bloodline calculation would work out since certain percentages of DNA can come from either parent. I may have inherited less of the Native American genes.

I was raised by a combination of wolves and bears. I had the best of both worlds. :D

How did that work then? Is it like the children are today getting passed around the family whilst the mothers care more about earning money and material things rather than their kids?

So there's no feathers in your hair? I thought red indians carried a tommohawk and worshipped a totem pole - no?

Do you speak like Tonto in the Lone Ranger? You know - say "heap" alot - like in "heap big trouble" - no?

Do you have a red indian name? Like "Big Jesse" or something?

You can't be a real one then.

Col

Question to God.

"Are you really American? because Americans think you are".

Col

Question to God.

"Are you really American? because Americans think you are".

Col
Which is amusing, when everybody knows He's C of E.

Question to God.

"Are you really American? because Americans think you are".

Col

No Col, we just know that like all people of the world that ask, we are blessed.

As are you.

Question to God.

"Are you really American? because Americans think you are".

Col
Nah Col., Americans just think they are God;)

Nah Col., Americans just think they are God;)

I think too many Americans think the current President is god.

I think too many Americans think the current President is god.
We all hope at this minute that he can perform miracles;)

We all hope at this minute that he can perform miracles;)


So far, no good.

So far, no good.
Early days yet, early days

Early days yet, early days

One man's miracle is another man's debacle.

Glad someone still has hope, though.:)

Glad someone still has hope, though.:)
Without it we're all stuffed;)

So far, no good.

He's got 8 years of incompetence and warmongering and corruption to clear up. Give him a chance.

Col

Nah Col., Americans just think they are God;)

That's true enough, their geater-than-thou arrogant attitude is enough to turn anyones stomach.
That's why so many comics in the UK use the Americans as joke material - it always gets a good laugh and a standing ovation.

I'm not sure it's possible to go a night on UK TV without hearing a joke about the Yanks.

Col

their geater-than-thou arrogant attitude is enough to turn anyones stomach.


You're American? :eek:

EDIT: You also may want to have a look at your spelling. I deduce you mean "greater".

You're American? :eek:
Well played, sir.

You're American? :eek:



Hah, just educated:cool:

You're American? :eek:

Not American nor red indian either - neither are you or you wouldn't be in a reasonably paid job.

EDIT: You also may want to have a look at your spelling. I deduce you mean "greater".

Fair play:)

Col

or you wouldn't be in a reasonably paid job.
Col

Maybe I'm not. :D

what happens when an irresistible force meets an immoveable object

its an inconceivable event


thats why its hard to conceive the right questions to ask god

-----------
and with regard to the benny hill joke referred to to at the top. i think it was a short SF story by Eric Frank Russell?, many years before


--------
if there were no Benny Cemoli, .... a short story by Philip K Dick

As to being Native American, I'm about 1/16th Cherokee myself. Not enough to count for special treament. Probably just as well.

Having two Native American grandparents makes you 50% Native American by legal definitions UNLESS the other grandparents were also mixed blood. Last I looked, in order to qualify for any benefits, you needed to be at least 1/8th NA, or maybe it was 1/4th. Whatever the number, I wasn't qualified for it. Yet another benefit I missed. Typical luck.

As to the God question, I would ask why He allows hatred to be fomented in His name.

As to being Native American, I'm about 1/16th Cherokee myself.

It seems that most Americans are. Is it some kind of "in thing" to be related to Red Indians?

Daniella seems to think he is also a half breed.

Col

I guess if you actually pick an apple off a tree to eat, not only are you prehistoric, but definitely not a sinner since no god ever existed to forbid it in the first place. :D

No food shops or supermarkets here, unless you count Wal-Mart. It's cheaper to buy the ammo and hunt for food yourself. We also barter our goods at small market streets, including salt-dried meats and hand-picked nuts and fruits. You have to be careful of the red berries with the spines, they are poisonous. After dinner, we all dance around a huge fire chanting for rain to feed our crops. Then we beat our many wives with clubs and drag them by their hair to our caves.

Wow Vassago, always thought you lived states side, turns out your in Glasgow???

The sooner they legalise euthanasia the better.

Col

I'll second that, I have a list :D

What one question would you ask God ( if there was one)


I have loads too, but I think the most pressing one is "how come you put two socks into the washer and only one comes out?"

Bigger questions I think I'll leave to her peers.

Currently in the UK there are adverts on the outside of buses questioning whether religion is socially unacceptable etc. (which it is)

One advert asks the question - "If there were a God - what one question would you ask him/her"

Any takers? What one question would you ask God ( if there was one)

Col

Can you please protect me from your followers?

I have loads too, but I think the most pressing one is "how come you put two socks into the washer and only one comes out?"

So that's where my other one went, :eek:

I wonder if that's an "out of washer experience"

Brian

All these questions can be answered at www.watchtower.org :)

All these questions have a clever opinion answer - nobody knows for sure there is a god. The advert on the side of buses I mentioned is more indicative of there being no god - i.e it's all a big joke.

Col

I don't know why they're advertising for members here, according to their own prophecy, there isn't enough room for the members they already have in paradise, let alone new punters. Anyway, they only achieved fame after Jimmy Hendrix sang a song for them:rolleyes:

It gets so boring too, every other week we have them knocking at the door handing out Watchtower magazines, if they like walking and knocking on doors, why don't they get a Kleeneze round they can make some money then as well ;)

It gets so boring too, every other week we have them knocking at the door handing out Watchtower magazines, if they like walking and knocking on doors, why don't they get a Kleeneze round they can make some money then as well ;)

And then when I use the mag for re-cycling purposes I discover they've used cheap bloody ink, it certainly leaves a mark!;)

It gets so boring too, every other week we have them knocking at the door handing out Watchtower magazines, if they like walking and knocking on doors, why don't they get a Kleeneze round they can make some money then as well ;)

I have a couple of deterents on my front door. First, the name tag on the door bell reads S.A. Tan, second there is a notice on the door saying please do not be offended if this door is slammed in your religious face. Haven't seen hide nor tail of any religious sects since I put them up.

Rich, I like your comment on Hendrix :cool:

I have to apologize....Jehovah's Witnesses are NOT advertising for members here or on any Web Site. I use this site on a regular basis for programming advice. I just thought this was a interesting discussion. I have wondered the same questions in this post and I just wanted to share what I found. This was in no way a reflection on Jehovah's Witnesses or to say that they are recruiting members on the internet. The work is being done by the preaching work as you already know. I have found the official web site very beneficial in answering my questions. Again, my apologies

I have to apologize....Jehovah's Witnesses are NOT advertising for members here or on any Web Site. I use this site on a regular basis for programming advice. I just thought this was a interesting discussion. I have wondered the same questions in this post and I just wanted to share what I found. This was in no way a reflection on Jehovah's Witnesses or to say that they are recruiting members on the internet. The work is being done by the preaching work as you already know. I have found the official web site very beneficial in answering my questions. Again, my apologies
I, for one, found the bit about cows on holiday quite informative.
How come none of the people who come to my door have ever mentioned that? :D

I have to apologize....Jehovah's Witnesses are NOT advertising for members here or on any Web Site. I use this site on a regular basis for programming advice. I just thought this was a interesting discussion. I have wondered the same questions in this post and I just wanted to share what I found. This was in no way a reflection on Jehovah's Witnesses or to say that they are recruiting members on the internet. The work is being done by the preaching work as you already know. I have found the official web site very beneficial in answering my questions. Again, my apologies

It takes a big man to admit responsibility. Thanks.

In truth the only issue I have with Witness faith is the issue of blood transfusions, if one of my children needed my blood to save their life I would not like religion to be in the way....

Now the wife on the other hand.... mmmm I'm seeing the benefits already.... :eek:


Only Joking.....

I have to apologize....Jehovah's Witnesses are NOT advertising for members here or on any Web Site. I use this site on a regular basis for programming advice. I just thought this was a interesting discussion. I have wondered the same questions in this post and I just wanted to share what I found. This was in no way a reflection on Jehovah's Witnesses or to say that they are recruiting members on the internet. The work is being done by the preaching work as you already know. I have found the official web site very beneficial in answering my questions. Again, my apologies

As you were responding to my post can I say that I took no offence and did not require any apology. If I contribute to a thread on God/religion I must expect believers of all and any religion, sect ,ideal etc to be able to reply.

Brian

Is the answer REALLY 42?

I think I would ask, "Why can't humans just grasp the simple concept of love and forgiveness?"

stike that...

I may ask why he gave us free will to invent marketing agencies.

Somewhere along our path we strayed. Now our worldly message is it is all about "Me" What's in it for me and screw the next guy... The world's view says I should have a bigger car, a monster home, a great job, marry barbie, have the perfect job and so on. Sad stuff....What's ya gonna take with you when you pass along?

Thank God for wisdom.

I've learned to love, live in harmony and share.

God bless, <>< Steve

I think I would ask, "Why can't humans just grasp the simple concept of love and forgiveness?"

stike that...

I may ask why he gave us free will to invent marketing agencies.

Somewhere along our path we strayed. Now our worldly message is it is all about "Me" What's in it for me and screw the next guy... The world's view says I should have a bigger car, a monster home, a great job, marry barbie, have the perfect job and so on. Sad stuff....What's ya gonna take with you when you pass along?

Thank God for wisdom.

I've learned to love, live in harmony and share.

God bless, <>< Steve

Very close to my beliefs.

It seems that most Americans are. Is it some kind of "in thing" to be related to Red Indians?

Daniella seems to think he is also a half breed.

Col

It always delights me to see people prove the value of their words.

Is the answer REALLY 42?As it says in the book. It all depends on what the question is

As it says in the book. It all depends on what the question is

I would like to point out that the character corresponding to the number 42 (ASCII Decimal) is the Asterisk. Wild card. Interesting

Matthew 22: 36-38 (Most Important Commandments - Love)
Matthew 6: 14-15 (Seriousness of Forgiveness)

Matthew 6: 14 drastically changed my life about 4 years ago. I never knew that about forgiveness.

Love and forgiveness...

Dear God:
Why are people who claim to know your will so fearful and prone to cruelty?
Is there value or purpose in suffering?

Love is the energy of God, that binds the universe.

Ask only for love.

I heard a great line yesterday, I may be paraphrasing a bit:

"Religion is like a great big dog - If it's your own, you think it's great and find it very comforting, but everyone else finds it, at best, annoying or, at worst unnerving. The least you can do is keep it away from kids."

I heard a great line yesterday, I may be paraphrasing a bit:

"Religion is like a great big dog - If it's your own, you think it's great and find it very comforting, but everyone else finds it, at best, annoying or, at worst unnerving. The least you can do is keep it away from kids."


The problem is, most people mistake religion, for pursuing the will of God.

The problem is, most people mistake religion, for pursuing the will of God.
Equally, many people seem to believe that they are able to interpet the will of God and so follow it.

If he existed and his way was that clear cut, there wouldn't be so many wars between people who all swear blind that theirs is the one true way.

Equally, many people seem to believe that they are able to interpet the will of God and so follow it.

If he existed and his way was that clear cut, there wouldn't be so many wars between people who all swear blind that theirs is the one true way.

Maybe it's a bit like placing a group of blind men in the centre of a maze and telling them there may be an exit, it's up to them to find out if there is and where it is if it exists. Each may go different ways and bump into others but they will each be convinced that the others arrived there either through cheating or some other sinister means because they didn't follow the same route!

Personally, I think I have actually met God, he opens at our local comedy club on a regular basis - he's the one with the really radical sense of humour :D

Personally, I think I have actually met God, he opens at our local comedy club on a regular basis - he's the one with the really radical sense of humour :D
He can't be amused by all those grumpy ministers preaching 'his word', then? :D

He can't be amused by all those grumpy ministers preaching 'his word', then? :D

Why ever not, he made everything in the world perfect! Even the grumpy ministers are "perfectly grumpy" :D

Why ever not, he made everything in the world perfect! Even the grumpy ministers are "perfectly grumpy" :D
There was a great Craig Ferguson routine from years back where he mentions 'a grumpy wee Presbyterian minister'. Doesn't sound half as good without the accent.

Equally, many people seem to believe that they are able to interpet the will of God and so follow it.

If he existed and his way was that clear cut, there wouldn't be so many wars between people who all swear blind that theirs is the one true way.

I generally don’t defend religion; I am more concerned with obtaining grace and spreading love, however…

If you are really seeking the energy of God, then look to love,
For at the core of all religions, is Love, and most religions had their start with someone, or a group of someones, seeking answers to the nature of the Universe.

If you are dissuaded by angry bible thumpers, seek to find out why they are angry, if you are sensing something is missing, seek answers, look at people, look for the beauty, and try to love them. Your energy will flow unto them and the energy of God will flow into you.

It’s quite exhilarating.


Give it a try, you may find that love is actually the energy of God.

I generally don’t defend religion; I am more concerned with obtaining grace and spreading love, however…

If you are really seeking the energy of God, then look to love,
For at the core of all religions, is Love, and most religions had their start with someone, or a group of someones, seeking answers to the nature of the Universe.

If you are dissuaded by angry bible thumpers, seek to find out why they are angry, if you are sensing something is missing, seek answers, look at people, look for the beauty, and try to love them. Your energy will flow unto them and the energy of God will flow into you.

It’s quite exhilarating.




Give it a try, you may find that love is actually the energy of God.


I prefer to love my family, because they're real, I find it exhausting

I prefer to love my family, because they're real, I find it exhausting

There's more to the Universe than you can see Rich.

I would love to be able to see what either the atheist or fundamentalist religious person sees.

After many many years of thinking about and investigating the whole issue I am still stuck at agnostic.

I sway around in the breeze. I have times where I am atheist but not for very long. I have times where I am at the Bible/Jesus deal but that is also short lived, although it holds up for longer than me being atheist.

The major thing that limits the time I am an atheist is that to be an atheist you have to deny the possibility of a higher life form than the human. A soon as you acknowledge a being or beings that are above the human then atheism is gone and it is very difficult to believe the human is the cheif intelligence of all beings in the universe. I just can't see it.

I do have some envy for the people who have arrived at a total belief in either extreme.

The Bible/Jesus deal has its big conflict in that nothing adds up....unless we assume God is not all powerful and all knowing.

I would love to be able to see what either the atheist or fundamentalist religious person sees.

After many many years of thinking about and investigating the whole issue I am still stuck at agnostic.

I sway around in the breeze. I have times where I am atheist but not for very long. I have times where I am at the Bible/Jesus deal but that is also short lived, although it holds up for longer than me being atheist.

The major thing that limits the time I am an atheist is that to be an atheist you have to deny the possibility of a higher life form than the human. A soon as you acknowledge a being or beings that are above the human then atheism is gone and it is very difficult to believe the human is the cheif intelligence of all beings in the universe. I just can't see it.

I do have some envy for the people who have arrived at a total belief in either extreme.

The Bible/Jesus deal has its big conflict in that nothing adds up....unless we assume God is not all powerful and all knowing.

Try reading The Celestine Prophecy

Try reading The Celestine Prophecy

As far has I have got

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Celestine_Prophecy

There are three possible beliefs:

1) Atheism. Basically meaning there is no superior being or beings that exert influence on us either directly or indirectly.

2) There is a being or beings that do exert influence on us either directly or indirectly and the being or beings are not all powerful and all knowing. I think this is where agnostics spend most of their time..

3) A specific religious belief such as the Bible/Christianity. My guess is that most people who call themselves atheist do so because of a lack of belief in this area but in reality they are probably agnostic.

As far has I have got

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Celestine_Prophecy

There are three possible beliefs:

1) Atheism. Basically meaning there is no superior being or beings that exert influence on us either directly or indirectly.

2) There is a being or beings that do exert influence on us either directly or indirectly and the being or beings are not all powerful and all knowing. I think this is where agnostics spend most of their time..

3) A specific religious belief such as the Bible/Christianity. My guess is that most people who call themselves atheist do so because of a lack of belief in this area but in reality they are probably agnostic.

In its most elemental form, matter doesn’t exist. It is best described in a non mathematical way as inertia, or even more simply, energy.

Going back, however many billions it takes to recompress the universe, we find only a small ball of pure energy. And in that ball, not even the size of a human brain, all of the elements that would eventually form the heavens existed. Can you imagine the life form that could dwell there?

And neither can anyone else.

So we invented religion to try to get a grip on something so fantastical, so absurd, so omnipotent, it denies description. We can’t get it, end of story.

Along comes a little knowledge; maybe in the order of billions of times the amount practiced by the ancients. We question the relevance of those ignorant people and loose faith.

But to those that seek, the power of God is very relevant. It comes into our lives and gives us strength to fight cancer, endure hardship and find joy in the simplest things. My life has always been blessed, but its because I have faith. That seems to be a paradox but in reality it is very simple.

Reed the book Mike I’ve known for many years the process spoken of in this book, and when I read it I knew finally, that others feel the same as I do, about the role God plays in the universe. I’m not saying that it has a better message than any other but it is in modern language and it really fits.

In the bible it talks about faith, love and hope, with Love being the strongest. I think the love of
God is the energy that Einstein and people like him discovered at the core of matter. And as an individual grows in his faith he becomes more and more able to let the flow of energy into his being.

I know I have.

I no longer think of God creating the universe, I think of God as the energy that bind the universe. And we are a small part of it. Think of it this way, Love is the energy that binds the universe and faith is the valve that lets it flow into us. Hope comes to us when we can’t find the valve but we know its there.

Once you start to look at it that way, many of the seemingly contradictive aspect of the study of God disappear.

One last thing on religion: A modern religion believes that random events given enough time can produce highly complex life. The absurdity of that is nearly unbearable to any thinking person; yet millions aspire to it.

Start asking the questions, see what you learn, or better yet see how you feel.

I wish you peace.
Joe

The major thing that limits the time I am an atheist is that to be an atheist you have to deny the possibility of a higher life form than the human. A soon as you acknowledge a being or beings that are above the human then atheism is gone and it is very difficult to believe the human is the cheif intelligence of all beings in the universe. I just can't see it.

It is amusing to me that you still cling to this argument, even though it has been explained many times on this forum that this is not true. I think "stuck" accurately describes your state of mind. To recap the many many many many posts on this subject, and to add just one more for the heck of it:
1. What is "higher" life form? Without a definition, this argument is meaningless. I wouldn't necessarily agree that humans are the most intelligent creatures even on this planet. Again, without definitions, adjectives like "highest" and "chief intelligence" are completely meaningless.
2. None of the atheists I know deny the possibility of life on other planets that would probably be very different than us if they existed.
3. The question of whether different life forms exist on other planets is completely irrelevant to the question of whether there is a god or not, unless your religion is scientology. If your religion is scientology, you have much bigger problems.
4. To be an atheist, all you have to do is acknowledge that we don't know. We don't know how everything came to be or what happened in "the begining" or even whether there was a begining at all.

It is amusing to me that you still cling to this argument, even though it has been explained many times on this forum that this is not true. I think "stuck" accurately describes your state of mind. To recap the many many many many posts on this subject, and to add just one more for the heck of it:
1. What is "higher" life form? Without a definition, this argument is meaningless. I wouldn't necessarily agree that humans are the most intelligent creatures even on this planet. Again, without definitions, adjectives like "highest" and "chief intelligence" are completely meaningless.
2. None of the atheists I know deny the possibility of life on other planets that would probably be very different than us if they existed.
3. The question of whether different life forms exist on other planets is completely irrelevant to the question of whether there is a god or not, unless your religion is scientology. If your religion is scientology, you have much bigger problems.
4. To be an atheist, all you have to do is acknowledge that we don't know. We don't know how everything came to be or what happened in "the begining" or even whether there was a begining at all.
He's going to ignore all bar the last point and say that you're an agnostic.

He's going to ignore all bar the last point and say that you're an agnostic.

I know, but it's been awhile since the last time we argued this point, and we are stuck under a blizzard here, so I figured, what the heck?

I know, but it's been awhile since the last time we argued this point, and we are stuck under a blizzard here, so I figured, what the heck?
:D
In that case, just to try to force a new direction, I'll use up the words 'chimpanzee', 'DNA' and 'animals see us as gods'.

:D
In that case, just to try to force a new direction, I'll use up the words 'chimpanzee', 'DNA' and 'animals see us as gods'.

I was watching an old episode of House, and Cameron answered the argument by saying that penguins don't have any business worrying about nuclear physics, so humans don't have any business worrying about whether there is a god or not. Do you think he would like that one?

4. To be an atheist, all you have to do is acknowledge that we don't know. We don't know how everything came to be or what happened in "the begining" or even whether there was a begining at all.

If you acknowledge the possibility of more advanced life forms than human (intellegence) then athiesm is thrown open to doubt.

I was watching an old episode of House, and Cameron answered the argument by saying that penguins don't have any business worrying about nuclear physics, so humans don't have any business worrying about whether there is a god or not. Do you think he would like that one?
It's a nice one-liner :D, but doesn't really lead anywhere.

How about if there's a god and everything was intelligently designed, how do Christians account for the Wayans brothers?

If you acknowledge the possibility of more advanced life forms than human (intellegence) then athiesm is thrown open to doubt.

Wow, you fulfilled Alcs prediction perfectly. Way to go Mike.

If you acknowledge the possibility of more advanced life forms than human (intellegence) then athiesm is thrown open to doubt.
Ha!
Alisa is an agnostic, Alisa is an agnostic. :p

He's going to ignore all bar the last point and say that you're an agnostic.

Because it is obvious.

Atheism is similar in principle to the Bible/Christian "born agains" There are no shades of gray.

As soon as other possibilities are acknowledged then you are agnostic.

It's a nice one-liner :D, but doesn't really lead anywhere.

How about if there's a god and everything was intelligently designed, how do Christians account for the Wayans brothers?

That's the beauty of religious belief, you only account for the things you feel like accounting for. Everything else is due to god's unknowable will. I love how believers get this huge loophole for everything they can't explain, but if there is one tiny gap in a scientific theory that is still undergoing research, then that invalidates the whole theory. Must be nice.

Wow, you fulfilled Alcs prediction perfectly. Way to go Mike.
For, lo, did I prophesee it would be so, and so did it come to pass.

Is mine the true Word? That is for others to say.

Ha!
Alisa is an agnostic, Alisa is an agnostic. :p

Well, that is what she said.

That's the beauty of religious belief, you only account for the things you feel like accounting for.

What is your definition or if like description of religious belief.

What is your definition or if like description of religious belief.

It is a mass delusion that causes people to believe that fairytales are real.

Because it is obvious.

Atheism is similar in principle to the Bible/Christian "born agains" There are no shades of gray.

As soon as other possibilities are acknowledged then you are agnostic.


I totally respect your right to have your own personal definition of atheism. I just want to point out that your definition is completely different than the generally accepted definition of the word. I think that since you yourself are not an atheist, you should defer to those who are for the actual definition of the word.

For, lo, did I prophesee it would be so, and so did it come to pass.

Is mine the true Word? That is for others to say.

Clearly.

You better start prophesizing the answers to everyone's questions right away.

I totally respect your right to have your own personal definition of atheism. I just want to point out that your definition is completely different than the generally accepted definition of the word. I think that since you yourself are not an atheist, you should defer to those who are for the actual definition of the word.

How would describe atheism.

How would describe atheism.

a meaning without
+
theism meaning belief in a deity

= without belief in a deity

1. What is "higher" life form? Without a definition, this argument is meaningless. I wouldn't necessarily agree that humans are the most intelligent creatures even on this planet. Again, without definitions, adjectives like "highest" and "chief intelligence" are completely meaningless.

A life form more advanced than us at the integellence level and perhaps physically. Is it true that the defining factor of a god or gods is to possess abilities above man?

2. None of the atheists I know deny the possibility of life on other planets that would probably be very different than us if they existed.

That also applies to the ones I know. However, they apply atheism to God, after life and so on. That is those things normally thought of as religion. But they agree in they are in reality agnostic. In terms of the common use of "atheism" I wouod probably be classed as an atheist.

3. The question of whether different life forms exist on other planets is completely irrelevant to the question of whether there is a god or not, unless your religion is scientology. If your religion is scientology, you have much bigger problems.

As I just posted a god is a being with abilities beyond us. I think you confuse "a god or gods" with God.

a meaning without
+
theism meaning belief in a deity

= without belief in a deity

Then how would describe diety. Would you include the various gods from ancient Greece etc.?

This is a meaningless debate; providing no insight to a better life, and not really any good questions either.

We must all learn to ask the right questions.

Well, that is what she said.
'To be an atheist, all you have to do is acknowledge that we don't know. We don't know how everything came to be or what happened in "the begining" or even whether there was a begining at all.'

All she's said is that she doesn't know the scientific processes behind the formation of the universe but is sure that it wasn't created by a god.

It's possible to be sure of what something isn't without knowing exactly what it is. e.g. One can see a flower, know that it isn't a rose, but not know exactly what it is. One can see a house, not know which construction company built it, but be certain that it didn't appear overnight, by magic.

This is a meaningless debate; providing no insight to a better life, and not really any good questions either.

We must all learn to ask the right questions.
Without getting into the pulpit, what might those 'right' questions be?

Then how would describe diety. Would you include the various gods from ancient Greece etc.?A person who believed in those gods would not be an atheist in my opinion. An atheist IMHO is some one who does not believe in a god/gods or any other supernatural being.

If somewhere in the universe there is a species who are much more advanced than us does not make them supernatural - just more advanced.

This is a meaningless debate; providing no insight to a better life, and not really any good questions either.

We must all learn to ask the right questions.

So what does a "better" life consist of?

This is a meaningless debate; providing no insight to a better life, and not really any good questions either.So why should it be different from many of the other threads then:confused:

It's possible to be sure of what something isn't without knowing exactly what it is. e.g. One can see a flower, know that it isn't a rose, but not know exactly what it is. One can see a house, not know which construction company built it, but be certain that it didn't appear overnight, by magic.

I know the point you are making.

However, the bottom line is that a being or beings that have abilities beyond us are falling into the gods zone, not necessarily the God zone but god zone. Do allow for the possibility elsewhere in the universe for beings with abilitiities superior to us.

Remember God is a particular god and is defined by being all powerful and all knowing. Not the same for god or gods.

Without getting into the pulpit, what might those 'right' questions be?

That's for every individual to decide for themselves. But you must truly seek the answer.

There’s way more to this, than the exchange of sun light and oxygen.

Energy is at the core, science tells you this, so it must be true, look for ways to feel the energy.

It exist, go look for it. Your life will change forever.

A life form more advanced than us at the integellence level and perhaps physically. Is it true that the defining factor of a god or gods is to possess abilities above man?

This is a classic logical error. Yes it is true that many theists believe that god possesses the attribute of greater abilities or intelligence or whatever you want to call it than people do. This is premise A in your argument. I will go along with premise A for the sake of the argument. Premise B is that it is possible that there is/are some being(s) in the universe that may be more intelligent than man. The problem in your argument is your conclusion. From premise A, that god is smarter than people, and premise B, that it is possible that beings smarter than people exist, you cannot logically conclude that god exists.

Let me make an equivalent illogical argument so you can see how silly this is:
A: God has a white beard.
B: There are people that have white beards.
Therefore: God exists.

It simply doesn't follow.

If somewhere in the universe there is a species who are much more advanced than us does not make them supernatural - just more advanced.

And by supernatural you mean able to defy the laws of physics or nature.

Do you believe the laws of nature/physics apply equally to the whole universe.

Give it a try, you may find that love is actually the energy of God.

Or vice versa! Seratonin!

I know the point you are making.

However, the bottom line is that a being or beings that have abilities beyond us are falling into the gods zone, not necessarily the God zone but god zone. Do allow for the possibility elsewhere in the universe for beings with abilitiities superior to us.

Remember God is a particular god and is defined by being all powerful and all knowing. Not the same for god or gods.
I've tried to avoid using a capital 'G' so as to indicate I was making the distinction. Sorry if I slipped up here and there.

Abilities superior to us still doesn't mean we'd think of them as gods. If there's some being somewhere out there who can lift 50 tons over his head, or change water to wine, or whatever, that's way beyond anything we can achieve but I would still look for the scientific explanation for his 'powers', rather than saying he was a god. Accepting him as a god would, to me, mean accepting without question that his abilities were magical. Since I can't believe that magic exists, I can't believe in gods.

If somewhere in the universe there is a species who are much more advanced than us does not make them supernatural - just more advanced.

What if there are other dimensions - multiverses and the like?... and they can somehow reach through into ours and ... Dam! I knew I shouldn't have accepted Tim's invitation to be friends :D

The problem in your argument is your conclusion. From premise A, that god is smarter than people, and premise B, that it is possible that beings smarter than people exist, you cannot logically conclude that god exists.

I don't say definitley, rather I say it opens the possibilities. When you say "god" with lower case are you referring to God.

So, how do you reconcile this statement
not really any good questions either.
and this one
We must all learn to ask the right questions.
with this one you made, when I asked you what the right question is?
That's for every individual to decide for themselves.
If one of us asks a question, who are you to say that it was 'not really any good' and so the wrong one to ask?

I've tried to avoid using a capital 'G' so as to indicate I was making the distinction. Sorry if I slipped up here and there.

Abilities superior to us still doesn't mean we'd think of them as gods. If there's some being somewhere out there who can lift 50 tons over his head, or change water to wine, or whatever, that's way beyond anything we can achieve but I would still look for the scientific explanation for his 'powers', rather than saying he was a god. Accepting him as a god would, to me, mean accepting without question that his abilities were magical. Since I can't believe that magic exists, I can't believe in gods.

So to qualify as a god he must be able to defy the laws of physics?

I don't say definitley, rather I say it opens the possibilities. When you say "god" with lower case are you referring to God.

Ok, I will restate:
From premise A and premise B, you can not draw any logical conclusion at all. You have repeatedly used the two premises to support the conclusion that it is possible that god exists. This is logically incorrect.

Are you going to ask me to capitalize the tooth fairy too?

So to qualify as a god he must be able to defy the laws of physics?
To me? Yes. Defy, bend, control, call it what you will.

I can't think of any examples of a god - be it Roman, Greek, Christian, Muslim, or whatever - where the being in question isn't supposed to have done at least one thing that is impossible for humans (or any known being) to do.

This ability must also be internalised and natural to them. I don't count the use of technology in this, clearly I could lift 50 tons if I had the right training and machinery. Nor do I count hidden machinery i.e. if some culture out there were advanced enough to lift that amount using some device I couldn't see.

So to qualify as a god he must be able to defy the laws of physics?

Well, the standard definition of god is that he created everything. Since it is not within the laws of physics to create something out of nothing, then yes, by the standard definition of god, he must be able to defy the laws of physics.

Or vice versa! Seratonin!


You're supposition is that the physical is the source, but we have proved that energy, not matter (therefore not chemistry) is at the core. As Einstein approached this epoch he understood that the only real answer is spiritual, not physical.

For billions of years electromagnetic waves traversed the universe; it is only in the last 200 years or so that we began to harness them. To deny the existence of more complicated energy fields or even an ultimate one, is short sighted. Truly the faith and fundamentalism of the non believers is something to be respectful of..

We tend to find what we’re looking for. The observation transforms the observed.

Well, the standard definition of god is that he created everything. Since it is not within the laws of physics to create something out of nothing, then yes, by the standard definition of god, he must be able to defy the laws of physics.

You might find the study of physics interesting. Here’s a question for you concerning the laws of physics.

How is the universe larger than it could possibly be, if it followed the most important law?

As matter approaches the speed of light; its mass become infinite.

You might find the study of physics interesting. Here’s a question for you concerning the laws of physics.

How is the universe larger than it could possibly be, if it followed the most important law?

As matter approaches the speed of light; its mass become infinite.

I do in fact find the study of physics interesting. However, the willingness to study physics implies a willingness to consider the possibility that there is a physical explanation of the origin of everything. If there is a physical explanation, that means we don't need the concept of god to explain it. Whether or not we humans with our piddly brains are ever able to figure out or comprehend that explanation is irrelevant.

Ok, I will restate:
From premise A and premise B, you can not draw any logical conclusion at all. You have repeatedly used the two premises to support the conclusion that it is possible that god exists. This is logically incorrect.

Are you going to ask me to capitalize the tooth fairy too?

When you use "god" I don't know which god you are referring to. Capitalising the G is nothing to do with respect.

For example, I could say "John Smith is the bible of Access" which of course means he is a wealth of information. The Bible is the specific book.

God is a god, one of many.

To me? Yes. Defy, bend, control, call it what you will.

I can't think of any examples of a god - be it Roman, Greek, Christian, Muslim, or whatever - where the being in question isn't supposed to have done at least one thing that is impossible for humans (or any known being) to do.

This ability must also be internalised and natural to them. I don't count the use of technology in this, clearly I could lift 50 tons if I had the right training and machinery. Nor do I count hidden machinery i.e. if some culture out there were advanced enough to lift that amount using some device I couldn't see.

Where we differ is I think a being or beings could be of such an advanced nature they could defy the laws of nature or at least some of the laws of nature. With the trillions of stars etc and etc I find it very difficult to believe that there is no being advanced enough to defy a few natural laws.

I do in fact find the study of physics interesting. However, the willingness to study physics implies a willingness to consider the possibility that there is a physical explanation of the origin of everything. If there is a physical explanation, that means we don't need the concept of god to explain it. Whether or not we humans with our piddly brains are ever able to figure out or comprehend that explanation is irrelevant.

But what if the possibility existed to participate in a more harmonious journey with the core power of the universe, would you indeed elect to refuse it?

Well, the standard definition of god is that he created everything. Since it is not within the laws of physics to create something out of nothing, then yes, by the standard definition of god, he must be able to defy the laws of physics.

By "god" I assume you are referring to the Bible God. However, that is only one god and most gods are not credited with being the all powerful and knowing.

Ya'll have fun.

But what if the possibility existed to participate in a more harmonious journey with the core power of the universe, would you indeed elect to refuse it?

What if WHAT possibility existed?

And by supernatural you mean able to defy the laws of physics or nature. Yes

Do you believe the laws of nature/physics apply equally to the whole universe. I believe there are fundamental laws of Physics that apply to the whole universe. Of course this is currently unable to be verified directly but we learn more each day.

When you use "god" I don't know which god you are referring to. Capitalising the G is nothing to do with respect.

For example, I could say "John Smith is the bible of Access" which of course means he is a wealth of information. The Bible is the specific book.

God is a god, one of many.

It doesn't matter which one - look at any holy scripture of any major religion. They all say the same thing - that god created everything.

It doesn't matter which one - look at any holy scripture of any major religion. They all say the same thing - that god created everything.

Check the ancient Greek gods and others. And then you have the various gods sed by primitive people, crocodile god etc and etc.

Check the ancient Greek gods and others. And then you have the various gods sed by primitive people, crocodile god etc and etc.

Maybe I should be more specific: major world religions = Islam, Christianity, and Judaism.
Ancient greek religions that nobody has practiced for hundreds of years do not constitute a major world religion.

Maybe I should be more specific: major world religions = Islam, Christianity, and Judaism.
Ancient greek religions that nobody has practiced for hundreds of years do not constitute a major world religion.

So is you atheism only denial of the gods referred to in the major religions.

What if WHAT possibility existed?

Go find out.

Go find out.

I thought that is where you went? :rolleyes:

So is you atheism only denial of the gods referred to in the major religions.

Technically, atheism is the absence of belief in ANY deity.

I personally see no reason to believe that anything supernatural exists or has ever existed, however, I am not going to say that all atheists agree with that statement.

If you want to talk about other deities in other minor religions that nobody practices anymore, or if you want to talk about all other manner of religous entities such as saints, martyrs, miracle workers etc., you should refer to them as such. You can safely assume that I am referring to god in the sense that he is defined in the world's major religions.

I thought that is where you went? :rolleyes:

You're pretty funny,

I will leave you with this; I have to get back to work.the tax payers of the US keep me in burgers, so ...

Just for a little exercise, try looking at coincidences as something more, and see what happens.

Chance happenings, gives you an opportunity to explore possibilities, so when you encounter someone, ask yourself why this person, why now. What questions can they answer for me?

See what happens.

You're pretty funny,

Just for a little exercise, try looking at coincidences as something more, and see what happens.

Chance happenings, gives you an opportunity to explore possibilities, so when you encounter someone, ask yourself why this person, why now. What questions can they answer for me?

See what happens.
Thales750, this is TimBrewer.
Tim, this is Thales750.

You should get on like a house on fire.

Thales750, this is TimBrewer.
Tim, this is Thales750.

You should get on like a house on fire.

It could be just a coincidence to have TWO of them posting here at the same time, or is it something more . . .

I think I will head to bed as it is 3.15am Saturday down here:D

It could be just a coincidence to have TWO of them posting here at the same time, or is it something more . . .
Perhaps some superior being has a plan to get all such people into the same place at the same time, to create superconfusion.

I think I will head to bed as it is 3.15am Saturday down here:D
Typical atheist..um, agnostic...whatever.
Blaming the time zones. :D

You're pretty funny,

I will leave you with this; I have to get back to work.the tax payers of the US keep me in burgers, so ...

Just for a little exercise, try looking at coincidences as something more, and see what happens.

Chance happenings, gives you an opportunity to explore possibilities, so when you encounter someone, ask yourself why this person, why now. What questions can they answer for me?

See what happens.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v126/chergh/leavetheinternet.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v126/chergh/leavetheinternet.jpg


Why thank you kind sir, suffering stupidity has always been one of favorite pastimes.

It's always a real treat, to have affirmations come in at just the right time.

So, how do you reconcile this statement

and this one

with this one you made, when I asked you what the right question is?

If one of us asks a question, who are you to say that it was 'not really any good' and so the wrong one to ask?


A meaningless debate is one where all of the participants are actively seeking to persuade the others, that their point of view is superior.

Whereas that might be effective for a high school debate teem, or an election, it is irrelevant for a philosophical discussion. The purpose of philosophy is to reconcile your place in the universe and to try to think outside the box. A difficult endeavor obviously, but worthy of the time spent.

So back to questions, ask the ones that bring you closer to the truth. Then be open, the worst thing a person can do is spend a life time pursuing vindication, for their limited point of view.

A meaningless debate is one where all of the participants are actively seeking to persuade the others, that their point of view is superior.
We're not discussing the best way to build a cabin, where there may be multiple answers, all correct. We're saying is there a god (any one). The answer is either yes or no. No grey area. So if you believe one way and you're not trying to convince everyone else that you're correct, why join in?

So back to questions, ask the ones that bring you closer to the truth. Then be open, the worst thing a person can do is spend a life time pursuing vindication, for their limited point of view.
Let's say you believe in God. I don't. You attempt, via your questions, to convince me that I'm wrong and you're right. How is that the worst thing that can you can do with your life? If you succeed, you have saved my eternal soul (or something).

Is pomposity considered a sin, because if it is I think somebody is in real trouble if their beliefs turn out to be true.

Brian

How would describe atheism.
Realis m

Realis m

Yes, but watch that space.

brian

Yes, but watch that space.

brian
I don't have time for lengthy answers, it is chinky night after all:cool:

Well thats a good way to fill a space. :D

Brian

Well thats a good way to fill a space. :D

Brian

Yes I'm well stuffed now, the odd thing is that I'm at the age where I won't feel hungry again in an hours time:confused::D

I would like to point out that the character corresponding to the number 42 (ASCII Decimal) is the Asterisk. Wild card. Interesting

and hex 42 is 66, which is "B" - is that significant

-----------
and I cannot say for certain but the 6th letter of the hebrew alphabet corresponds to W, i am told

which makes 666 correspond to WWW

is that a fact?

and hex 42 is 66, which is "B" - is that significant

-----------
and I cannot say for certain but the 6th letter of the hebrew alphabet corresponds to W, i am told

which makes 666 correspond to WWW

is that a fact?

Almost Gemma. The 6th letter is often pronounced W but it's actually a V.

Is pomposity considered a sin, because if it is I think somebody is in real trouble if their beliefs turn out to be true.

Brian
What do you meen by that, Brian?

and hex 42 is 66, which is "B" - is that significant

Sure. 66-42 = 24 which is 42 sdrawckaB.

and I cannot say for certain but the 6th letter of the hebrew alphabet corresponds to W, i am told
which makes 666 correspond to WWW
is that a fact?

While interesting, I cannot say if 'www' is indeed 666. It makes sense. But I'm not going to subscribe to it. I do, however find that 6 * 6 + 6 = 42. :p

I looked up the sixth letter of the hebrew alphabet. It's Vav. Not being a linguist I can't say how it's pronounced or if it indeed does correspond to our letter, 'W'.
I did found some nifty little factiods I found whilst browsing up the sixth letter, Vav. These are significant to the Jewish religion in particular. I list these mearly as 'thought provokers' and not reflections on my personal beliefs. These are not included in the gospel according to Lil' Rascal.

There are:
Six Days of Creation, and their six corresponding Divine forces active in creation.
Six letters of the word bereishit, "In the beginning."
Six alefs in the first verse of the Torah.
Six-millennium duration of the world.
Six directions of the physical world.

Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune, intoned in the distance by an invisible player.

Albert Einstein (http://quotes4all.net/authors/albert%20einstein/quotes.html)

"The word god is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this."
Albert Einstein (http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2008/may/12/peopleinscience.religion/print)

Proving that even our greatest thinkers struggle with defining the power that creates the universe.


Further investigation into Mr. Einstein’s philosophy will reveal a lack of trust in common organized religion. Yet he demonstrated on many occasions the same disdain for science, and he practiced both until his death, belief in a higher power and science.

The point is, and back to one of my earlier assertions, if you take your disbelief as an axiom, you then eliminate the possibility of spiritual growth, not emotional growth, or an increase in you’re morality, but spiritual.

If you don’t believe in a spiritual existence then it naturally follows, you would search for it even more strenuously, as even the best scientist follow leads they find difficult to visualize.

Putting aside personal prejudice is a difficult process for most of us. But sometimes in life we find that the things we cling to the most, somehow have a way of returning full circle.

My only advocation in this debate is that if you are not seeking answers beyond the highly limited ones science can provide, then you are cheating yourself out of greater possibilities.

If you don’t believe in a spiritual existence then it naturally follows, you would search for it even more strenuously, as even the best scientist follow leads they find difficult to visualize.

No it doesn't. If you're unsure about it, you may look all the harder, just to settle the matter, if nothing else. If you don't believe in something at all, you never look for it.

My only advocation in this debate is that if you are not seeking answers beyond the highly limited ones science can provide, then you are cheating yourself out of greater possibilities.
Alternatively, if you ignore scientific evidence because it doesn't correspond with the supernatural view you've decided upon, you're on a slippery slope toward lucky heather, touching wood, seeing ghosts, and the like.

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No it doesn't. If you're unsure about it, you may look all the harder, just to settle the matter, if nothing else. If you don't believe in something at all, you never look for it.

Alternatively, if you ignore scientific evidence because it doesn't correspond with the supernatural view you've decided upon, you're on a slippery slope toward lucky heather, touching wood, seeing ghosts, and the like.

I personally, am a rigorous scientist, and not particularly prone to ignoring anything.

Fortunately for us Heinrich Hertz believed in things he couldn’t see.

I personally, am a rigorous scientist, and not particularly prone to ignoring anything.

Fortunately for us Heinrich Hertz believed in things he couldn’t see.
Well, good for you. Luckily, you've got the fallback not available to every scientist, where you can neatly box away anything you can't explain as being God's work.

What does Heinrich Hertz have to do with the conversation? If I remember right, his work was on light waves. When did he do work investigating something he firmly believed did not exist, as opposed to something he couldn't see? I can't see oxygen. I'm fully prepared to admit it's present. God is another matter entirely.

Well, good for you. Luckily, you've got the fallback not available to every scientist, where you can neatly box away anything you can't explain as being God's work.

What does Heinrich Hertz have to do with the conversation? If I remember right, his work was on light waves. When did he do work investigating something he firmly believed did not exist, as opposed to something he couldn't see? I can't see oxygen. I'm fully prepared to admit it's present. God is another matter entirely.

I guess I should have said detect with his senses.

I guess I should have said detect with his senses.
I knew what you meant :)

Still stands. Did he ever say that he believed 100% that he was looking for something that did not exist?

There are:
Six Days of Creation, and their six corresponding Divine forces active in creation.
Six letters of the word bereishit, "In the beginning."
Six alefs in the first verse of the Torah.
Six-millennium duration of the world.
Six directions of the physical world.
6 Millenium duration of the world:confused: Bit strange idea of a planet that is approx 4.5 Billion years old by a member of a species that has been around for several million years and was producing art that has survived for nearly 20,000 years.

6 Millenium duration of the world:confused: Bit strange idea of a planet that is approx 4.5 Billion years old by a member of a species that has been around for several million years and was producing art that has survived for nearly 20,000 years.
Just re-read that post, it also says

Six letters of the word bereishit, "In the beginning."

Is it just me, or are there nine?

6 Millenium duration of the world:confused: Bit strange idea of a planet that is approx 4.5 Billion years old by a member of a species that has been around for several million years and was producing art that has survived for nearly 20,000 years.
Don't shoot the messenger. lol

I looked it up and today's date According to the Hebrew calendar: 5, Nisan 5769. So, Looks like we have another 231 years until the end of this millenium. Don't tell that to the Mayans though.

Is it just me, or are there nine?
Looks like someone forgot to add:

Dim In The Beginning as Variant

In the Beginning = Mid("bereishit", 2, 6)
Or would a left function be more suited to an "In the beginning" statement?

5*7+6+9-(2*3+1) = 43
Looks like 42 just got shot to hell.

Don't shoot the messenger. lol

I looked it up and today's date According to the Hebrew calendar: 5, Nisan 5769. So, Looks like we have another 231 years until the end of this millenium. Don't tell that to the Mayans though.

The Hebrew calendar is not relevant to the length of the world. The world has existed for approximately 4.5 Billion years. So what on earth is the relevance of 2240 AD. Do you think the world is going to end then. But anyway that does not make the Earth only 5769 years old.

The Hebrew calendar is not relevant to the length of the world. The world has existed for approximately 4.5 Billion years. So what on earth is the relevance of 2240 AD. Do you think the world is going to end then. But anyway that does not make the Earth only 5769 years old.
No, I do not think that the world is going to end. I hope it's not going to anyways. The relevance of 2240 A.D. is in regards to the "Duration of the Word" as indicated by the Jewish religion which remains relevant to the 6th letter of the Hebrew alphabet which is relevant to 5796 years which brings us full circle.

Before you crucify me, here's what I said in the first post that brought on the whole thing:
These are significant to the Jewish religion in particular. I list these mearly as 'thought provokers' and not reflections on my personal beliefs. These are not included in the gospel according to Lil' Rascal.

The one thing about boards I'll never get used to is the lack of tone. Perhaps I should drop a :D or a :p every once in a while to make sure that my sarcasms aren't lost on cyber ears. :p

No, I do not think that the world is going to end. I hope it's not going to anyways.


I'm afraid it's a fact that the world is going to end

No, I do not think that the world is going to end. I hope it's not going to anyways. The relevance of 2240 A.D. is in regards to the "Duration of the Word" as indicated by the Jewish religion which remains relevant to the 6th letter of the Hebrew alphabet which is relevant to 5796 years which brings us full circle.


I think you'll find that the "word" is a reference to what we now perceive as God. In ancient scripts they referred to the creator as the "word" because they did not want to limit it by labelling it and felt that even to call it God would be limiting.

I have not come accross this reference to the duration of the word, it's new to me. Thank you for giving me something new to investigate.:cool: