A Bit Confused (1 Viewer)

JamesJoey

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I've been using Access for a very long time.
But, now, when I read about database management I am a bit confused now. Maybe things are different now then they were before.

Just looking for the basics.
First, (I'm using MySql as an excample) MySql isn't a Datrabae Management System, right?? It's simply a programming language to manipulate the data and datatypes in tables??

But, my confusion lies in what to call the actual program that one uses to create forms and reports for viewing the data.

I seem to be seeing the term Database Management System.
One wouldn't call MySql a Database Management System. Right?
Although I searched the web for "Database Management System" and MySQL was listed as one on one of the hits.

I have the data I use in access separate form my forms and reports and the like.

Please explain the terminlogy for me.


Thanks,
James
 

The_Doc_Man

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OK, one man's viewpoint here:

Access is a Rapid Application Development product (RAD) which includes the necessary interfaces to actually RUN the application you just developed.

MySQL and SQL Server are indeed database management systems. It is the forms, reports, etc. that make a database into an application. And Access just happens to swing both ways on this, since it includes the ACE engine to actually manage the tables that are your database. It also has the form/report generators to instantiate the forms and reports that are part of your application. The other part of the application is the database that goes with it.

So...

Tables + Database Engine + Schema (including relationships) = Database

Query + Form + Report + Other stuff + Database = Application

Does that help?

I'll further state that the multiple vendors out there DON'T help in this confusion because I don't believe that they use a uniform choice of nomenclature. They have their own special words that they like to use and industry standards be damned. Sort of like IBM back in the 1960s - 1980s, until the anti-trust lawsuit.
 

JamesJoey

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Ok.
So, if I wanted to switch to MySQL, will I find all the tools I need in order to create forms, reports...?
 

The_Doc_Man

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You already have it. It's called Access, which is not locked into using only the ACE engine. If you have the necessary DLLs for the given DB such that Access can perform the required remote connection, stay with Access for the Apps.

Some vendors provide their own tools: E.g. ORACLE with ORACLE Tools. Some are strictly DB engines only. And it is possible to use Microsoft's .NET for some things. There are tons of tools, but not all RDBMS (Relational Data Base Management Systems) come with such tools.
 

JamesJoey

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Some, I've seen are pretty expensive.

Well, let me ask one more question.
I'm using Access 2010.

Would it be worth my while to upgrade to Access 2016?

Is there any indication when the next version of Access is coming out?
 

isladogs

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I'm using Access 2010.

Would it be worth my while to upgrade to Access 2016?

Is there any indication when the next version of Access is coming out?

That depends on your needs.
1. If you use pivot tables/charts, don't upgrade as they've been deprecated.
2. Minimal new features apart from e.g. new datatype bigint. If you use that, your database can't be opened in earlier versions.
3. The interface in A2016 has some issues that still haven't been resolved
4. On the other hand, A2010 will only be supported for another 18 months or so

IMHO, it's not worth upgrading.

The next version will be released this autumn but if you have Office 365 the changes will be incremental.
It's meant to have much better charts though
 
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Pat Hartman

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Access is named Access because that is what it gives you. Out of the box since version 1.0, Access has had the ability to support multiple users and link to ANY RDBMS that supports ODBC. It wasn't until version 2.1 that Jet (the desktop database engine frequently confused with Access) actually shipped in the Access box. At that time, Jet was used by other Office applications and Windows to manage application data and so the Jet database engine shipped with Windows.

In 2007, the Access team took over the development of Jet (.mdb files) and renamed it ACE (.accdb) files. Jet is still managed by the SQL Server team but I'm not sure that it has any active development going on. The SQL Server people caused quite a lot of chaos in the period leading up to the release of A2007 because they kept telling people that "Access" was dead because they think Jet is Access. Let's blame MS for the confusion.

Access is the RAD tool used to develop APPLICATIONS.
Jet/ACE are the desktop database engines.

Access uses Jet (.mdb) or ACE (.accdb) to hold its own objects but data can be held in any ODBC complient RDBMS including Jet and ACE. Over the years, I've used at least a dozen different RDBMS' to connect to Access. Using a "real" RDBMS frees Access from the constraints of Jet and ACE and as long as each user has his own copy of the FE database, the BE will support as many concurrent Access users as you have seat licenses for the RDBMS. So, if you have 1,000 seat licenses, you can have 1,000 concurrent Access users.
 

Mark_

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The trick I use to remember what is required for a "Database Management system" is that the tables AND what is required to relate them is managed by ONE program.

If you had flat files YOUR application would be responsible for every update, addition, and deletion along with keeping referential integrity when you change or delete data. A "DBS" manages these for you.

The user interface (How data gets put in/output) is in the hands of applications that ask the DBS for data OR ask it to update data. So far, every DBS I've seen does manage the relationships though other "Management" pieces may or may not be there (security, multiple ways to load data, design or reporting tools, ect...)
 

Pat Hartman

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I forgot, the other point of confusion -

Although both DAO and ADO can be used to script object creation and changes, most people prefer to use a GUI and Access the RAD tool provides that. SSMS is the GUI for SQL Server. I don't know the names of the GUI's for other database engines.

You can prove to yourself that Jet/ACE are independent of Access (although the reverse is not true) if you have any other development platform. For example, you can create a form using Visual Studio and have it work with a Jet or ACE table. You can compile that app and take it to a computer that does not have Access installed and it will run as long as you have ACE installed. ACE is available separately from Access but since Access uses ACE to store its objects, Access installs ACE when Access is installed.
 

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