Are Capitalists inhumane? (1 Viewer)

Jon

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Is everything about money? Are those hard-nosed capitalists lacking compassion for the less fortunate? The wealth gap is widening. Do we really want a society where the few are living a life of luxury while the rest are struggling to survive? Surely that is the end result if the widening continues.

Are these Capitalists inhumane, only looking after their own selfish interests?

I don't know, you tell me!
 

The_Doc_Man

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Some are, some aren't. There are capitalists who are truly greedy. There are those that set up charitable foundations and continue to feed those foundations. So I think there is no "blanket" answer.
 

Jon

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If a capitalist, like Jeff Bezos, contributes $10B to save the planet, is he just doing it for selfish reasons, to buy popularity? Or it is for true benevolence? Does it matter either way, he is doing public good? This assumes climate change is predominantly caused by mans influence, as opposed to other reasons.
 

Jon

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What about if it is a bribe?
 

The_Doc_Man

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Money is not evil regardless of who gave it to you. The person's motives MIGHT be evil, but money is faceless. Put it to good use. Put it to bad use. Hell, give it to me and let me worry about the good or bad. It's all the same with respect to the money.
 

pbaldy

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Generally speaking, the way greedy capitalists get rich is to provide a product or service that people want at a price those people are willing to pay. How is that evil? Capitalism is (or at least should be) based on freedom and voluntary exchange. Can it be corrupted? Sure, companies get government to gain them advantage in many ways. That's not the company's fault, it government's. Why do you think people/companies spend billions getting certain people elected? ;)
 

Jon

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What if someone wanted a life saving treatment and the capitalist suddenly hikes the prices from say $20 per treatment to $520 per treatment? I think something similar happened in America. Was it the drug for epilepsy or something? I recall it being some injectable type thing.

The price has to be paid to prevent serious medical consequences, the profit margins are in the thousands of percent and they have a near monopoly.

So, is that evil?
 

pbaldy

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I would say that is the exception, not the rule, because of the unique features of that market. For example, computers get more powerful and cheaper all the time, because of competition. A friend just bought a new TV that was bigger and better than ours for quite a bit less than we paid. I had to stop my wife who wanted to go get one. Again, competition.

I don't recall the drug, but I do remember that situation. To say it's messy and complicated would be an understatement. I don't pretend to have an answer; I don't even know all the questions.

As you say, the drug companies have a near monopoly. They have it in part because the government makes it so expensive and time consuming to get drugs approved that only big players can afford to play. We all want safety, but how many drugs that could have helped people weren't worth pushing through that gauntlet?

We also have the government preventing the importation of drugs from outside the country, even drugs that originated here. I have friends that spend the winter in the southern US where it's warm. They go to Mexico for medical/dental/drugs. I asked about quality, they said the doctors were US educated and trained. I've heard of people getting drugs in Canada because the same drugs were cheaper there.

Dinner time here, gotta help my beautiful blushing bride.
 

The_Doc_Man

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We all want safety, but how many drugs that could have helped people weren't worth pushing through that gauntlet?
Paul, I agree with your point but I also remember a drug that made it through (inadequate) testing some years ago - thalidomide. It was eventually linked to a birth defect called phocomelia, in which infant extremities more closely resembled baby seals with fused fingers and toes, or more severe defects such as being born without arms. A whole lot of grief came through because testing wasn't adequate. There IS no substitute for adequate testing but Big Pharma wants to bypass that stuff because it costs them money.

One thing you should notice now, though. Listen to drug company direct-to-TV-advertising of some of their drugs and the litany of possible side effects. The comedian Jeff Foxworthy even does a comedy bit about drug side effects. In the link, the relevant part starts at 1:20 or so.


Some of the TV drug commercials even say things like,,, "If you or a loved one has encountered heart palpitations, dizziness or death when using XYZ, call a doctor immediately and discontinue dosage." I'm not kidding - I've actually heard a drug commercial similar to that. Well, I assure you that if I died, I probably DID discontinue the dosage - but I probably didn't call the doctor fast enough. Darn the bad luck.
 

scott-atkinson

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If a capitalist, like Jeff Bezos, contributes $10B to save the planet, is he just doing it for selfish reasons, to buy popularity? Or it is for true benevolence? Does it matter either way, he is doing public good? This assumes climate change is predominantly caused by mans influence, as opposed to other reasons.
I'm sure down the line somewhere you'll find it's Tax Deductable, nobody these days, especially the Rich do anything unless there is sometjhing in it for them..
 

pbaldy

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Doc, I can't disagree with you. Perhaps I should have just said that for purposes of this thread, the drug industry isn't representative of Capitalism. It's a highly regulated and controlled industry.

I also like the commercials that say "don't take xyz if you're allergic to xyz". Duh, really? That said, they probably got sued by somebody who was allergic and took it anyway.
 

The_Doc_Man

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I also like the commercials that say "don't take xyz if you're allergic to xyz". Duh, really
Which sounds like another of Jeff Foxworthy's cronies from the Blue Collar Tour, Bill Engvall. He does a routine called "Here's your sign" regarding reasons why certain signs have been posted. Usually, being awarded a "sign" implies a certain density on the part of the recipient.

Such as, on the inside of the outer door of the airliner, a sign that says "Do not open door while plane is flying."

 

vba_php

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Are these Capitalists inhumane, only looking after their own selfish interests?
Jon,

you're missing one point here that is very important. Never forget that the USA *always* gets its way in the world when it comes to bringing its profit-seeking nonsense to other countries when it can't sell anymore in its currently dominant areas. Case in point => their current invasion of Africa and spreading the capitalism over there. I'm currently producing a website and mobile app for a 22 year old over there that doesn't have the brain power to write the code himself. He told me that his country is pretty poor but it is getting better due to the influence of America on its businesses. I had to explain to him that, even though its a great thing that more people have the opportunity to be employed through the capitalistic system, the *real* reason that America is over there is because many other people in the world have started to realize that buying corporate $hit is something they don't need. Thus, the corporate cronies have found Africa, which is a *huge* consumer market and profit center. I told him not to be fooled by what seems to be a great thing, but rather realize what the real motivation is. I mentioned to him that the USA doesn't really hesitate to spread the profiteering even if they have to go to war over it. That might not be a lot of the case this day in age, but certainly it has happened int he past.

On a positive note though, he told me that he was "guided" by "something" to find me on a mentorship website I have an account on when he came up with this idea. Not sure how much truth there is in that one. But none-the-less, he's willing to pay to have his dream come true, so I'm happy to do it.
 

Jon

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Define point.
 

The_Doc_Man

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Another typical anti-capitalist rant. As my Yiddish great-grandparents would say, A shainem dank in direm pupik. (Loosely translated, a heavily sarcastic "Thanks a lot" or "Thanks for nothing." Literally, "I thank your belly button.")

If you don't like the USA's capitalist leanings, Adam, I have to ask if your hatred is because of your incompetence at supporting yourself in a capitalist world? I'm trying to decide your motivations and can't.
 

vba_php

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I have to ask if your hatred is because of your incompetence at supporting yourself in a capitalist world? I'm trying to decide your motivations and can't.
well not really, richard. the point that I make comes from the spiritual rather than the material. but I do realize that some sort of system has to exist otherwise we'll be thrown back to the barbaric days. but the unfortunate thing about any systems is that it *will* result in what christ mentions in the gospels.
 

vba_php

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So as you rant about American profiteering in Africa...
well who's gonna help this poor kid, Paul? He doesn't have funds to purchase a developer's services, basically anywhere. and obviously I'm not going to do a huge amount of work like that for free. for one thing, I don't have the time.
 

The_Doc_Man

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So we've got poor people in the world. This is not news. But Adam, YOU should realize that it will always be the case. The poor will always be with us.

Read Matthew 26, first 10 or 10 verses, where even Jesus says we will always have poor people. (I'm paraphrasing.)

So sure, there is a poor kid, but you just admitted to doing the same thing that you condemn in others. You offer a small amount of help but realize that you don't have enough resources (in your case, time rather than money) to go around. So if we don't empty OUR pockets for charity, you decry our greedy capitalist tendencies. But the odds are you will try to tell me I don't get the point.
 

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