Question Do we need to leave Access? Help ! (1 Viewer)

[thomas.dahl]

June 17, 2010 - thoimas.dahl@web.de

I was wondering if I am the only one..

We have a MS Access 97 replicated and synchronized database running in our office which I created 10 years ago and contains a huge amount of data, forms and reports and which essentially runs our business. The "master" .mdb sits on a small cheap computer in a corner of our office and never crashes or needs much maintenance other than an automatic daily back-up. We have several users who run a local copy of access and a replicated backend which they synchronize periodically with the server. A small neat set-up that works great.

For the rest of our software we have switched to OpenOffice now that it has all its little bugs and issues ironed out and Firefox of course. Actually we are very impressed with what we are using. We use "The Bat" email client and a VPOP3 mail server running on the same little computer in the corner. All very good and dandy. We have the usual firewalls, Adaware, Spybot, Avast and AntiSpamSniper running in various places on our system.

All the clients run windows XP which we bought with each computer as we have acquired or replaced our machines over the years. We must have dozens of WinXP licences by now which have gone dormant.

So.. On Monday this week my laptop dies (it is now Thursday). I rush out and buy a beautiful little ACER which I think I am going to like a lot. And then the software installation started..

I soon discover that Access 97 will not run on the installed Windows 7 and I need to spend more money and that "XP Mode" would be my solution. After paying ¤190 for an "Ultimate" upgrade and about 10 hours of fiddling about with XP Mode I have concluded that Access 97 may well run in XP mode BUT my database files will not. I have reinstalled, updated, service packed the application to death and it simply will not work without crashing or giving strange error messages that we never had on the virgin WinXP platforms. I have basically given up.

Seeing as my laptop needs Win7 drivers etc. I have been reluctant to install WinXP but I may now have no choice.. This is now June 2010 and Microsoft have announced that XP will not be supported any more so my reluctance is obvious.

Late last night I downloaded a trial copy of Access 2010 and here are my conclusions and experience:

1. Man, is the interface ugly. The ribbon takes up so much space and what is the idea behind the "Navigation Pane". Yuck! I guess one can get used to anything, but I am not impressed so far.

2. Seems I must run my files in .mdb mode for the synchronization to still be possible but whatever I try I get meaningless error messages and it looks like even if I could get it to work the "Master" needs to be updated as well. After hours and hours or fixing and reading forum posts I have come to the conclusion that the backwards compatibility of using the format .mdb simply does not work reliably and even if I could eventually get it to work I would need to update every computer in the office to Access 2010 to be able to synchronize with the same "Master". WTF !!

3. I have concluded that the only way I can get the set-up to work is to move to the new access .accdb format. And this is where the fun really starts.. it will only work with a SharePoint server. A SharePoint server will only work with a Windows Server and all of this now requires licensing and hardware upgrades etc etc. I spent about an hour on the microsoft web site to try to figure out what this would all cost and simply could not find out any pricing... Apparently I need to apply for a "quote". This can only mean one thing! It will cost me a lot of money and time. Anyway, I do not want a "server". We are slowly moving towards cloud computing and I see this as a step backwards.

4. I do not really have a problem to buy a bunch of Access 2010 licences and move to the new version of Access.. But I have no desire to build a SharePoint server to simply get what I have today.. With no new features. And also, do not forget, I do not need to use a SharePoint server for anything else other than run store the Access master backend. I simply do not need any of its other features.

Anyway, this is a long post to simply ask one question:

What would you recommend we do? Is it time to abandon Access and move to another DB? In which case which one? It means a lot of work, but maybe I am cornered now and need to fight my way out of my microsoft trap. Maybe it is getting close to a time where we can abandon microsoft completely. The ONLY other reason we use windows is the for our printer drivers and "The Bat" email client.

The way Office 2010 seems to be developing I have less and less interest in getting to grips with it.

I have not found a single benefit within Windows 7 other than the fact that the operating system seems even more intrusive. All we want to do is use applications and I hate the way Windows 7 takes up so much time to get to grips with. For me an operating system should be hidden in the background and simply get on with it. I have to repeat.. What does Win7 do for me that WinXP did not? I have not found a single reason in my daily use to upgrade other than the fact that future drivers may not work anymore. I think Win7 is an industry wide conspiracy to get us all to spend more money for little or no benefit for the user.

Any ideas guys.. Specifically the database issue..

Regards
Thomas Dahl

 

[gemma-the-husky]

see if you can get a copy of A2003 - its much more similar to A97 than A2007/A2010, (look and feel) and I think will still run under windows 7.

your A2010 licence should cover A2003 if you can get it.

 

[Lightwave]

Just to confirm in my experience Access 2003 runs well with Windows 7

And there are no ribbons associated with Access 2003

Might be worth a try and would give you a few years to think about moving a majorly business critical system.

 

[thomas.dahl]

Thanks guys.. That is a pretty smart suggestion. I just had a look on Ebay and Offie/Access 2003 is more expensive that Office/Access 2007 !!!

I think this tells you a lot about people's opinion of the later versions of Office.

If I get this to work in Access 2003 I will have to hit Ebay hard to find copies of Access 2003. Funily enough it seems that Office Pro 2003 is cheaper than the pure Access 2003 program. Not sure why people are not buying the full package and then only install what they need.

Do you happen to know if WinXP is the best platform to store the master on, or if there are any advantages (speed, backup, security etc) to replace XP with Win7? I am only interested in doing this if we have a clear advantage as WinXP seems to be working fine.

Cheers !!

Thomas

 

[John.Woody]

I have access 97 running on my Windows 7 PC.
http://www.access-programmers.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=194004

 

[Galaxiom]

All the clients run windows XP which we bought with each computer as we have acquired or replaced our machines over the years. We must have dozens of WinXP licences by now which have gone dormant.

Licences which come with new computers are usually OEM licences that only apply to the hardware they came with. Only Full Packaged Product (FPP) and Open licences can be transferred to new machines.

Late last night I downloaded a trial copy of Access 2010 and here are my conclusions and experience:

1. Man, is the interface ugly. The ribbon takes up so much space and what is the idea behind the "Navigation Pane". Yuck! I guess one can get used to anything, but I am not impressed so far.

The navigation Pane is the replacement for the Database Window. It is easily flicked open and shut. It is actually much easier to find than the buried database window of older versions. It is highly configurable and if you take the time to understand how to use it you will find it is a major improvement.

The Ribbon can be run minimised so that it takes up no more room than the old menus. I would never want to return to the old menus.

2. Seems I must run my files in .mdb mode for the synchronization to still be possible but whatever I try I get meaningless error messages and it looks like even if I could get it to work the "Master" needs to be updated as well.

3. I have concluded that the only way I can get the set-up to work is to move to the new access .accdb format.

I work with several A2000 mdb databases and design in mdb mode. I have not experienced any problems running them in either A2007 or A2007 Runtime.

And this is where the fun really starts.. it will only work with a SharePoint server. A SharePoint server will only work with a Windows Server and all of this now requires licensing and hardware upgrades etc etc.

I don't know what you are doing to synchronise but I see no reason why the backends cannot be synchronised as simple databases with append, delete and update queries.

What would you recommend we do? .... [another long M$ogynistic rave] .....

I would suggest you go and parade your sentiments somewhere with other like minded people. They will be able to help you choose an alternative to Microsoft products and can help you work around the inevitable limitations you will experience.

 

[Galaxiom]

your A2010 licence should cover A2003 if you can get it.

Only for Open Licences.
FPP and OEM licences for Office are not downgradeable.

 

[boblarson]

I can understand frustration with things but you have to realize that if you choose to remain with a software version then you are pretty much locked into the environment that works on and if you don't continuously upgrade along the way then you are going to, one day, find yourself unable to use the product you've been using.

Is that fair? As a developer, I have to say yes it is fair. You may not realize how difficult it can be to be able to maintain backwards compatibility. Eventually it really makes no sense from either a financial standpoint or from even a technical standpoint.

So, for those who like to find a version of an operating system (not just MS mind you) and a version of a product and then keep using it because it works, that is okay up to a point. But the longer you wait to upgrade makes it no longer a viable option to do a simple upgrade because you've waited way too long.

 

[dfenton]

First off, to get WinXP mode, you didn't need to buy Win7 Ultimate, only Win7 Professional.

Second, A97 runs just fine on WinXP. I'm running it on this PC, and until a couple of years ago when I migrated everybody to A2003, had many clients running that configuration.

In short, I honestly don't see any reason why your setup should not work just fine with WinXP mode, with no need to upgrade. Keep in mind that there can be significant incompatibilities with A97 databases converted to a later version (for example, in A2000, you get the issues with subforms and field/control references, with A2002/2003, you get issues with control references in queries that don't get properly resolved when the controls are Null; there are many other gotchas), and unless you're actually planning to upgrade everybody and do a significant refactoring of the front end, you are better off getting A97 running.

In fact, you actually can't upgrade one user to a Jet 4 version of Access and leave the others in A97, because a replicated Jet 3.x back end is read-only in the Jet 4-based versions of Access (or, for that matter, any version of Access except Jet 3.x-based versions). So, unless you want to upgrade everybody, you're forced to get A97 running on your new PC.