"poorly stated joke"

Bodisathva said:
I actually read the entire joke that Kerry was supposed to use and while quite scathing, actually did exactly what it was intended to do, not what the Republican spin machine has created here.

If you still feel the need to dig, though, the whole "too dumb to stick with the teleprompter" argument is quite valid IMHO ;)
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Where did you read that? I would be interested to know. Also, is it really spin if they are upset about what he said and not what he was supposed to say? I mean, I know both sides are spinning stuff all the time but having read what he said, I can see why people are upset. I personally think the guy is a moron. :D
 
KenHigg said:
You kind of lost me here - When you say he was 'supposed' to say something, makes me think he in fact did not say what he was supposed to. In which case how could what he was 'supposed' to say do anything?
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The actual joke in the speech was directed at Dubya, and essentially boiled down to "if you're not smart, blah, blah, blah... you get us stuck in places like Iraq, just ask GWB". I want to say I found it on NPR ...I'll not be able to verify it 'till I get home and away from smart filter, though.:( Basically, he just didn't give the speech as written...I would assume that means they had a teleprompter there that he managed to somehow ignore. I thought he should have stayed on the campaign trail and stuck to his guns, explain the mistake, play human, and keep going, but instead they decide to run away and give the battle to the repubs.

MrsGorilla said:
Also, is it really spin if they are upset about what he said and not what he was supposed to say? I mean, I know both sides are spinning stuff all the time but having read what he said, I can see why people are upset. I personally think the guy is a moron.
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I suppose the deciding factor is intent. You have to admit, most will react differently if they perceive the slight out of shear maliciousness as opposed to just a stupid mistake. The repubs are trying desperately to get everyone on the "he did it on purpose" bandwagon, trying to rally emotions, etc, etc. What he said, taken in context, without knowing what was written, is a lot out of bounds, but should be seen as a mistake instead of an intentional foul.
 
Bodisathva said:
The actual joke in the speech was directed at Dubya, and essentially boiled down to "if you're not smart, blah, blah, blah... you get us stuck in places like Iraq, just ask GWB". I want to say I found it on NPR ...I'll not be able to verify it 'till I get home and away from smart filter, though.:( Basically, he just didn't give the speech as written...I would assume that means they had a teleprompter there that he managed to somehow ignore. I thought he should have stayed on the campaign trail and stuck to his guns, explain the mistake, play human, and keep going, but instead they decide to run away and give the battle to the repubs.
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I'll take your word on it and apologize for not researching it further. If that was what he was supposed to say then it appears to have been a simple goof up on his part. My bad - :o

Kerry is off the hook on this one - Sorry gang. :( At least I have mud on my face here instead of in front of my boss :eek: :p
 
KenHigg said:
I'll take your word on it and apologize for not researching it further. If that was what he was supposed to say then it appears to have been a simple goof up on his part. My bad - :o

Kerry is off the hook on this one - Sorry gang. :( At least I have mud on my face here instead of in front of my boss :eek: :p
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Meh...I still have to say he's a moron for saying what he said rather than what he was supposed to say, if that's the case. Either he said it maliciously, or he said it because he was too stupid to follow the teleprompter. Not looking good for him either way. Any time fellow Democrats are backpedaling to distance themselves from the stench and try to save their own elections, you know it has to be bad. :D
 
I just found another reference here:

Kerry was supposed to say, "I can't overstress the importance of a great education. Do you know where you end up if you don't study, if you aren't smart, if you're intellectually lazy? You end up getting us stuck in a war in Iraq."
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I also heard Lieberman in an interview talking about Kerry's status as a veteran, asking the rhetorical "do you really think a man with his experience and background" questions.

The only mud I see on your face Ken is the collateral damage from all the Republican slinging...don't worry about it:)
 
MrsGorilla said:
Meh...I still have to say he's a moron for saying what he said rather than what he was supposed to say, if that's the case. Either he said it maliciously, or he said it because he was too stupid to follow the teleprompter.
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agreed
MrsGorilla said:
Not looking good for him either way. Any time fellow Democrats are backpedaling to distance themselves from the stench and try to save their own elections, you know it has to be bad. :D
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but you have to admit, he's got a point:
But Kerry refused to relent, calling the criticism part of the "classic GOP playbook."

"I'm not going to be lectured by a stuffed-suit White House mouthpiece standing behind a podium, or doughy Rush Limbaugh, who no doubt today will take a break from belittling Michael J. Fox's Parkinson's disease to start lying about me just as they have lied about Iraq."

He further expressed disgust with "Republican hacks, who have never worn the uniform of our country."

Kerry added that President Bush and Vice President Cheney "owe our troops an apology" because they "misled America into war."

Bush and Cheney "have given us a Katrina foreign policy that has betrayed our ideals, killed and maimed our soldiers, and widened the terrorist threat instead of defeating it," the senator said.
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Isn't it amazing that with this on his side, the spin machine continues to work so well? Politics gives me a headache:D
 
By the way, I still think the joke in it's original form was probably a bad idea (although not as bad as how it came out). Like I said earlier, if he wants to take a dig at Bush go ahead, but the military shouldn't be part of any joke. Just my opinion...
 
MrsGorilla said:
If he wants to take a crack at Bush so be it, but leave the military out of it.
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But doesn't Bush drag the military into it when it suits, and in any case isn't it true that Americans only elect those with a military backround to high office?
 
Rich said:
But doesn't Bush drag the military into it when it suits, and in any case isn't it true that Americans only elect those with a military backround to high office?
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Did Clinton have a military background? Reagan?
 
Matty said:
Thanks Matt -- that's some interesting info. I guess the facts got to Rich again. :rolleyes:
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Yes you're right I should have said most, or the vast majority, take your pick if you want to nit pick and search for the very few exceptions
 
Rich said:
Yes you're right I should have said most, or the vast majority, take your pick if you want to nit pick and search for the very few exceptions
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Well if W is the 43rd president, and there are 12 (according to Wikipedia) that did not serve, that means 28% did not serve. "Very few exceptions" doesn't seem like the proper term.

Edit: I counted incorrectly. There's 11 that didn't serve (26%)
 
Last edited:
Matty said:
Well if W is the 43rd president, and there are 12 (according to Wikipedia) that did not serve, that means 28% did not serve. "Very few exceptions" doesn't seem like the proper term.
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It does when you compare the figures with those of a normal country
 
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