Programming - Special Symbol Syntax Rant (1 Viewer)

Steve R.

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Since we are all stuck at home, more or less, we get to dwell on minor irritants and let them fester until they become major irritants. In this case, it would be nice if all programming languages would use a set of standardized symbols, such as the "#" for comments, "&" to concatenate strings, and to have a terminator to show where an if statement or a case statement ends.

I just happened to be working on a BASH script and have been examining a lot of threads related to that. Additionally, I was looking at using regex, but became quite confused over the different flavors. For now, attempting to untangle regex has been put on the back-burner.

I am sure that there are many good reasons for why the developers of a particular programming language such as Python have selected the special symbols that they have. However, it seems that when a person is developing a particular application, they pick and choose snippets from various languages. That allows opportunities for confusion. Seems that using certain constructs in a standardized manner would not really have an adverse effect on people creating and/or improving computer languages.

Concatenation Comparison of programming languages (strings)
 
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The_Doc_Man

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I think the worst I ever saw along these lines was APL (A Programming Language). It had some of THE most obscure syntax I ever saw for some of its strange matrix operations.
 

NauticalGent

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Steve...of you're interested, I've got quite bbn the book on Regex.
 

Steve R.

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I am out of touch with today's slang. What does "bbn" mean?

As a quick summary, I am attempting to duplicate the Access "NotInList" event on an HTML form. It appears that I need to use a javacript rendition of regex. I can't seem to relocate the webpage that I was studying. But I did save the reference for this StackOverFlow question.: How do you use a variable in a regular expression? I was stuck over how to use the "RegExp object" to find a string in an array (drop-downlist). I am not doing anything with it now, so I don't expect a response. When I get back to it (always tomorrow, since i am retired), I can let you know. Thanks for the offer and responding.
 

vba_php

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Steve if everybody use the same syntactical language where what would be the fun in that? Furthermore don't you think it is a competitive thing?
 

vba_php

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Maybe you guys are unaware but most other languages other than basic does use a Terminator for statements
 

Steve R.

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Steve if everybody use the same syntactical language where what would be the fun in that? Furthermore don't you think it is a competitive thing?
Having obscure non-standard syntax gives us something to complain about and to propose "superior" solutions to the "idiots" who developed the language.
 

vba_php

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Having obscure non-standard syntax gives us something to complain about and to propose "superior" solutions.
if I were you Steve I would not wait for Superior Solutions because the day that that happened is the day you will be out of work so I have no idea why you're even proposing that
 

vba_php

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Furthermore if you saw my latest post in the water cooler you would know then Microsoft is already trying to put people out of the work due to their corporate greed. If they are going to put into practice what they are proposing or what the CEO is proposing there will be no need to write code anymore in the near future now how stupid is that? That simply makes for ignorant people and that's exactly what Microsoft and large corporations want because it enables them to sell
 

The_Doc_Man

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And AS USUAL you put the negative spin on the idea of self-programming systems. Do you know why I had such a good run with my computer knowledge even though my original training was as a chemist? It was because there are so few people who can THINK in the right way to program a computer. There are so few people who can muster the mental organization required to successfully navigate your way through a computer-based problem. The skill is SO rare and the demand is SO high that people will adopt desperate measures to get the jobs done. They'll even hire someone like you because all the top-notch developers are already taken.
 

vba_php

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They'll even hire someone like you because all the top-notch developers are already taken.
that's about the stupidest comment I've ever heard anybody make about me so I'll discarded just like the rest of your nonsense Richard. But the truth of the matter is I'm not even going to stay in the program and game or probably in the technology game for a couple reasons. Number one the Lord doesn't want me to do this stupid crap anymore anyway and number to the corporate people of the world are going to automate the jobs that programmers are doing now anyway so it's pointless to continue the career path. I was sure that someone like you who's retired and built up those years of wisdom in your brain would recognize that by now don't you? For instance you and Steve should be smart enough to realize what is inevitable in the future and what inevitabilities are coming from the corporate world. If you want to stay on top of things you should realize that. It disappoints me to know that you're not that smart
 

The_Doc_Man

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We can hardly wait for you to get out of the program. What is keeping you?

Adam, you don't see the theoretical imbalance there, do you? Of course you don't, why do I ask....? So the simple programs get built by automation, leaving room for the more intelligent and more skilled people to handle the tougher cases. But don't forget that over 80% of all businesses are SMALL businesses who can't afford the fancy-schmancy automated solutions, so they will hire people to do their jobs because the automated solutions don't conform to their business model. The only thing that automated programming does is it changes the demographics - but not the demand.

The more things change, the more they stay the same.
 

vba_php

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I think you missed the point of what I was saying Richard. The point is that the corporate world is notorious for creating massive amounts of ignorant people and thus the ignorant people will buy and buy in massive quantities the corporate products whether the damn things work for them or not it doesn't really matter. And therefore the marketplace for somebody like me or somebody like you guys especially when information is giving being given away for free on a forum like this gets very very small and thus in turn there's no room to make money. But that doesn't matter in my case because I'm not interested in doing the work for other reasons. But it just so happens that I might become a priest or another religious figure and actually help young kids do this work too and become a teacher that's a real possibility in my life right now
 

The_Doc_Man

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The point is that the corporate world is notorious for creating massive amounts of ignorant people and thus the ignorant people will buy and buy in massive quantities the corporate products whether the damn things work for them or not it doesn't really matter.

Except that corporate America does have training programs and reimbursement programs for their employees. I have used that a few times and many of my Navy contractor colleagues used it. When I worked for private industry 35 years ago, I got in-house training AND got sent to classes held in other cities. Corporate America doesn't create ignorant people. Most of Corporate American executives are conservatives.

It is the liberals who dumb down our schools by insisting on social promotion and opening the floodgates to uneducated people from other countries. It is the liberals who would overwhelm our school systems with a tide of children who have no foundation for higher learning. It is the liberals who enable the slackers. Read the Doonesbury comic strip that has been running lately, showing the liberal mind-set that good grades are deserved, not earned. If you want to blame someone for creating massive amounts of ignorant people, don't look to Corporate America.

Or are you too blind to see THAT little fact, too?
 

vba_php

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I suppose what I was pointing out is that Corporate America and leaders regardless if they are liberals or Republicans they all take advantage of lesser minded people and unfortunately 90% of the general public are lesser minded people. So the only obvious answer to that is proper education of those lesser minded people but then of course you run into the problem of whether or not those lesser minded people even want to learn or care to learn or even have the ability to put forth the effort because that's always been a problem since the beginning of the Earth
 

The_Doc_Man

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You actually seem to have seen a part of the problem with your last couple of sentences. We try to educate everyone in this country, Adam, but it doesn't always stick. Do you not remember the parable of the sower and the seeds? Should we NOT try to educate everyone even though we know that some will get it and some will not? Isn't that the same error as cursing the less fertile field simply because it behaves according to its nature?

The problem is that businesses DIE if they can't get their work done. And if the business dies, people lose jobs and starve. So the only way that the business owner can thrive is to find ways to get jobs done even though the workforce isn't there. Automation is one way. Another way uses the so-called H1B visa, which allows skilled and educated immigrants to come to this country to work because we don't have the manpower (personpower?) to fill the jobs.

Just before the corona virus hit, we were running along at unemployment rates lower than they had been in FIVE DECADES and we STILL didn't have enough people for Corporate America. Don't blame them for people who choose not to learn or who are unable to learn. That doesn't go on their shoulders. They are the ones who discovered the problem, but they didn't cause it. They have to cope with it and they don't have infinite time to run education programs for it, either.

Didn't you tell us a few months back about a job you were considering that would pay for your education for specific skills they needed? That doesn't sound like Corporate America producing dumb people, Adam.
 

vba_php

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Didn't you tell us a few months back about a job you were considering that would pay for your education for specific skills they needed? That doesn't sound like Corporate America producing dumb people, Adam.
no, actually it wasn't richard. but the issue with that company is that they were literally trying to turn young people into machines by making them memorize all sorts of technological nonsense that only a machine-minded person could understand. that's probably why they are still posting numerous jobs in every city in the world. because young people want to do the work through their passion and their soul and not be turned into soul-less machines.

that's exactly why I didn't accept their proposal. but we don't have to worry about that now, because like I said the AI will start to do those jobs and the young people won't have to fall victim to being machine-oriented non-soul entities. there's a good part to that too, because it saves young people from becoming machines and having their soul stripped away from them. it also proves the point that young people are not equipped enough mentally to deal with the rigors of corporate programming requirements.

as far as educating people is concerned, a good example of what's coming is the ever-so-popular concept from MS called POWER APPS. obviously to God it makes no sense and is completely irrelevant, but from a prospective of business and growth, it makes perfect sense because what it will do is empower people to think they're smart and develop for themselves. unfortunately, in reality though the machines will be doing most of the work. but that is also irrelevant, because the point of the whole program is to GET other people to create money making ideas and expand the economy, which I'm sure it will do. ignorance can produce massive amounts of economic expansion of machines can do 90% of the work for them. wouldn't u agree?
 

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