Replacement for Access (1 Viewer)

[StephenB]

My company has been trying kill off its use of Access for over 10 years now. Every time a new IT executive comes in, they decree that access will be eliminated. The only thing that has prevented this from happening is the company-wide question “Well, what do you want us to use instead?”

Once again, we have a new IT exec, and we’re going through the motions again. Except this time, scuttlebutt has it that the new IT exec has talked the CEO into suffering the consequences. IT guy’s position is “let the company go through its withdrawals. We won’t die from it.” And this time, rumor has it, when the question of a replacement comes up, his reply is going to be “I don’t know. Figure it out.” I’ve personally moved several DBs off access to excel wherever I can but excel is not the answer for everything. Some of my peers are moving to MySql, but they find it slower to work with.

So my question is; what applications are there out there, with user-friendly GUIs, that super-users can use instead of Access

 

[plog]

.. with user-friendly GUIs, that super-users can use instead of Access

Powerapps: https://powerapps.microsoft.com/en-us/


But, what makes you think that (or anything) is going to be acceptable? There must be a reason Access is verboten. I've been in organizations similar to yours and the main concern is IT control. They don't want core data on systems they don't control. IT feels they are ultimately responsible for all systems in an organization, even the ones they don't support. They fear the person in charge of that external system will leave and it will be in a technology IT has no person who has experience with.

So, whatever new non-Access system you choose probably won't be to IT's liking. They want everything moved to whatever database they use (Oracle, SQL Server) and all UI development done via whatever their developers use. To defeat this you need to find a high level person who relies on data from an existing Access database and tell them that this new decree makes the data/report/chart/etc they really like go away. IT will be forced to ensure that system is the first integrated into IT (often with an deadline unacceptably too far in the future for the key stakeholder) or allow an Access exception. And once you get one Access exception everyone will expect one.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Hire an assassin to take down the new exec. It'll be cheaper. {OK, just kidding ... a little bit}

I've watched companies try this before. None of them that I have seen were able to do it simply. The issue is that the Access package is not only based on the ACE database engine but it has the Access Rapid Application Development environment and GUI that makes it hard to replace cheaply. Ask the new IT exec how many person-hours he is willing to spend retraining people. Ask how many customers he is ready to lose because the new software in question (whatever it is) has proved intractable enough that the replacement stuff isn't ready yet.

People who say "I don't know, go figure it out" don't have a plan or a clue.

Moving a DB to Excel is actually WORSE than using Access because now you have all the ugliness imposed by flat-file structuring and you still need to use VBA to do anything really fancy.

You might - stress MIGHT - wish to look into ORACLE Tools as a potential replacement and use an ORACLE back-end. (Which also would work with a web front-end.) However, the stuff that goes into advanced Access event routines will give web programmers fits. The Navy did something similar to this as I was getting ready to retire, but the project took literally several years during which we HAD to run what we ran in parallel so business could go on as usual.

 

[Micron]

Moving a DB to Excel is actually WORSE than using Access because now you have all the ugliness imposed by flat-file structuring and you still need to use VBA to do anything really fancy.

Not to mention that Excel is a one-user-at-a-time thing?
Typical IT narrow mindedness, mostly because they're afraid of what they don't understand. Sometimes it's because they expect they'll have to fix your db issues as well, so a compromise might be that IT supports distribution to users but there's no support for whatever you develop. That all assumes that if you mine any corporate data, it's strictly on a read-only basis. Then there's always runtime versions for non-developers if licensing is an issue.

 

[theDBguy]

Hi Stephen. This is probably not feasible in your case; but if someone tells me we shouldn't use Access at work, I would try to ask "the why?" What are their reasons for eliminating Access? If they say because of "this" or "that," then I would try to address those concerns. If I have no answer for their concerns, then I would be happy to use something else. Just my 2 cents...

 

[Galaxiom]

A sensible executive doesn't walk in and wipe out functioning tools on a whim based on the technology. Any change should be planned. Ask for a copy of that plan.

 

[Jon]

They should just send the IT guy here to get their skills up.

 

[vba_php]

They should just send the IT guy here to get their skills up.

LOL. you're right Jon, like I've said, we kick major a$$ around here.

Stephen,

there's all sort of options your leaders have. do you have anyone that knows how to write web apps? if you do, you can implement any of these:

=> C#.NET/ASP.NET/any controller object WITH sql server backend DB (on apache server, or their own, this software only runs on windows)
=> VB.NET/ASP.NET/controllers also (optional) WITH sql server backend (on IIS server or their own, this software only runs on windows)
=> HTML/CSS/javascript/any other interfacing tools WITH PHP/MYSQL backend DB (runs best on apache server and linux)
=> virtually anything you can find in visual studio 2019 (or older version).  the development package is here:

https://visualstudio.microsoft.com/vs/

=> access front end interface WITH almost anything as a backend DB (mysql, sql server, I assume oracle too,
more than likely the DBs in the Azure platform from microsoft like Cosmos)

regarding the last point, I'm almost positive you can use ODBC drivers found on the internet to connect access to almost any other database. I just helped a guy on this forum last week who was trying to connect it using a PHP function, which obviously won't work. but he was able to find a driver that supposedly could connect access with a db called "pervasive". so that just shows that you can use access to connect to almost anything more than likely.

 

[Steve R.]

My company has been trying kill off its use of Access for over 10 years now. Every time a new IT executive comes in, they decree that access will be eliminated. The only thing that has prevented this from happening is the company-wide question “Well, what do you want us to use instead?”

When I was working, I had this problem too. The IT department obstructed attempts to improve the Access application. They cited typical bureaucratic reasons such as security and the need for "full" documentation before they would even consider assigning it to an unnecessary "development" team..

So my question is; what applications are there out there, with user-friendly GUIs, that super-users can use instead of Access

In this regard, I have two comments. The "front-end" and "back-end".

For the "back-end", I would encourage the use of an open source database, such as MySQL and MariaDB to move away from Microsoft.
For the "front-end", I would encourage the use of a browser, such as Firefox that uses PHP/HTML/CSS. Essentially, the GUI is self-developed.

 

[vba_php]

For the "back-end", I would encourage the use of an open source database, such as MySQL and MariaDB to move away from Microsoft.

no complaint from yours truly on this one! people should do anything to steer clear of MS's convoluted nature when it comes to server-based products and front-end integration with them.

 

[Steve R.]

Moving a DB to Excel is actually WORSE than using Access because now you have all the ugliness imposed by flat-file structuring and you still need to use VBA to do anything really fancy.

A pet peeve of mine, attempting to use a spreadsheet for a database application.

 

[AccessBlaster]

Access has the ability to run unattended, IT fears automation. They also fear supporting an app they don't understand.

We have three Access apps running full time in a Simi minor roll with around 15 users. IT refuses to support these apps, it's fine I created them. I lobbied them for server space 10 years ago.

The problem is I am getting ready to retire, oops. You can see how IT will be annoyed.

 

[vba_php]

IT fears automation.

I just finished a job 2 months ago at a large energy company in this area where I wrote some python and queries some massive database to fix flowed financial contracts and their data. the python expert there brought IT out of their fearful shell after 10 full years of requesting that they get on board with his scripting solution to make the company more efficient.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

The problem with IT folks is the NIH problem: Not Invented Here. That is, someone other than the IT staff did something useful and they feel that it totally impinges on their jobs or negatively reflects on their abilities. I cannot BEGIN to tell you how long I had to work with our Navy IT security guy before he would allow us to use Access for our security-action tracking database. But the good news? When I talked to him, I realized that K.B. was educable. I had to be able to demonstrate that I could conform to his security rules, but when I demonstrated that I could do that, he "green-lighted" the project and just told me to keep him in the loop as things developed.

 

[StephenB]

Moving a DB to Excel is actually WORSE than using Access

Yes, this is what I've discovered. I found myself telling my boss "Yeah, I got into excel, but it's ugly, less user-friendly, and now we can’t do x, y and z ."

 

[StephenB]

They should just send the IT guy here to get their skills up.

Big oof!!

 

[The_Doc_Man]

The argument has to be that if they are going to keep Excel, Word, PowerPoint, and Outlook - which are all part of Office, then to get rid of Access which integrates with Office better than any 3rd party product is to cut off your nose to spite your face.

 

[Frothingslosh]

Well, they could always set up SQL Server or Oracle systems, hire a DBA to run them, hire at least one full-time application devloper (cheaper than the DBA, normally, but not all THAT much cheaper), and then spend the necessary time required to convert the applications from Access to the non-VBA solution of their choice. Should only cost them a few hundred thousand and anywhere from six months to a few years.

 

[Frothingslosh]

And for the record, my employer (more specifically, my director) last year instructed us to move our applications from Access to C#. We already had the SQL Server databases going. We're STILL doing the conversions, because about half of the 14 Access apps we supported were EXTREMELY complex (and we keep getting assigned other, higher priority stuff). If we were to just shut them down and 'go through withdrawal', the company would lose the approximately $100,000,000 per year those apps bring in via the processes they enable.

 

[zeroaccess]

Yep...it's always "security concerns" here. But, no further explanation of what these issues are, no plans for any real replacements and no desire to spend $100,000 for an Oracle solution. And no, I don't consider your half-baked spreadsheets and InfoPath forms proper replacements for Access databases.

This is why Access exists - it fits in a (large) niche where people need more than spreadsheets but have no need for the high $ solutions. IT's response should be "Yes! We will ensure you have the network capacity to run your application". And if it isn't, someone in company management should ensure that it is.