Should Trump have been impeached? (1 Viewer)

Should Trump have been impeached?

  • Yes

    Votes: 2 40.0%
  • No

    Votes: 3 60.0%
  • Unsure

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    5

Jon

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Whatever your political persuasion, what do you think on this one?
 

vba_php

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oh come on, Jon. Per Colin's request:
do we really need another religious thread?
....I would say that applies here too, doesn't it? I'm sure this'll draw plenty of heat just like my thread did. But to take the bait, I say that it doesn't matter whatsoever because they'll never remove him from office, just like they never removed Clinton after he was impeached. But have you seen this, sir?

https://www.msnbc.com/weekends-with...on-also-predicted-his-impeachment-73604165926

that guy apparently predicted the last umpteen USA elections correctly, and it seems to be that he was right on this one too.
 

The_Doc_Man

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Since the beginning of his term in officer, the Democrats have said they were going to impeach him, even before he had done anything. It took them this long to come up with a fairly flimsy excuse. If "abuse of power" were a real problem, Obama should have been impeached when he attempted over a dozen clearly illegal executive orders that infringed on the powers of Congress.

My take on this is that he was trying to get dirt on Biden because of shady deals (including bribery) in the Ukraine. But he couldn't legally investigate because of jurisdiction issues. So he asked the Ukraine president to investigate and gave him an incentive. Since a bribe was on the table, he added a little cash incentive to counter the bribe. However, the money that was earmarked for the Ukraine WENT to the Ukraine before the allocation deadline anyway, without the investigation. As to "obstruction of Congress" there is an argument regarding whether it is obstruction or merely insisting on the observation of separation of powers. Again, a viewpoint issue.

The Dems have been like rabid dogs on this. I don't 100% support what Trump has done, but he has done some good things and actually tried to honor his campaign promises. (Rare in a president.) Depending on which candidate the Dems offer in November, I might be forced to vote for DJT one more time. If it is Biden or Sanders, the Dems are a lost cause. The others? Not as sure about that case.
 

kevlray

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Of course of some of the evidence points to Trump trying to influence the election with foreign powers. Not sure how factual the evidence really is. Then I had heard (do not remember the source) that at one time Trump had stated as long as he was in office he could do anything he wanted (i.e, basically he was free from any sort of prosecution). I do not know where he got the that idea.
 

The_Doc_Man

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He got it (incorrectly) from the constitution. The president is immune to almost all forms of prosecution - but not the kind that is called "Impeachment." You cannot arrest the president for a traffic violation, for example.

As to the evidence pointing to an attempt to influence the election, here is my question: IF Joe Biden really DID try to bribe off the prosecutor who was looking in potential misdeeds and malfeasance of his son Hunter Biden while he was managing a Ukraine government contract, then Trump was faced with a dilemma. He could not legally send USA law enforcement to the Ukraine to investigate that situation because there is no law in the USA that relates to US citizens attempting to bribe foreign officials. (There IS a law for US corporations - but not for individuals.)

So the question is this: Trump, because the Department of Homeland Security reports to him, is in effect the chief law enforcement officer of the USA. Even the USA Attorney General reports to him. He has a duty to protect the constitution. If he learned of public bribery by a person such as Joe Biden in a foreign country, and if that person might become the next president, does he or does he not have an obligation to root out crime of a very high level. Let's face it. If someone tried to bribe a U.S. federal attorney, wouldn't you want to know about that?

So anyway, that phone call was made to root out a purported wrong-doing by Joe Biden. And it doesn't matter if later that story was found to not be true. The question is, "What was known and what was rumored at the time of the phone call?"



There are those who want to say that all of the charges have been debunked. And that might be true. But if the charges were still uncertain at the time then I think Trump would have been right to follow up on it.
 
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Then I had heard (do not remember the source) that at one time Trump had stated as long as he was in office he could do anything he wanted (i.e, basically he was free from any sort of prosecution). I do not know where he got the that idea.
Yeah, he says this type of thing at his rallies. Its purposely designed to make peoples head explode. Its not to be taken seriously, he will often say "I'm not leaving office even if I win a second term". Again, designed to make you freak out. People need to lighten up a tad, the sky hasn't fallen yet.
 

Jon

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I think a lot of it is about if Trump is acting in the countries interest or not. If Joe Biden was corrupt, and Trump got it investigated, is that not in the public interest, since you don't want to elect a corrupt President in 2020?
 

NauticalGent

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Yes...but then the previous two idoits should have been impached as well.
 

Steve R.

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No. This is a blatant Soviet style political hit-job by the Democrats. The (insane) articles of impeachment are vague and irrational.

The US has three co-equal branches of government. Consequently, the Democratically controlled House can not claim that the President obstructed Congress. Apply this logic from the President's perspective, Congress is obstructing the President. The President (as the chief law enforcement officer), instead of impeachment (since that does not apply), could simply arrest any member of Congress that is obstructing the Executive Branch. Obviously, what I just wrote, presents a management conundrum of "who's in charge?". Most disputes between the Executive Branch and the Legislative branch are resolved by the Judicial branch. The Democrats in the House did not pursue this option. The Democratically controlled House (while it has impeachment power) inappropriately abused that power. (As a further example of abuse of power, Nancy Pelosi attempted to bully the Senate by demanding that the Senate provide the House with the rules for how the Senate will conduct its trial. Pelosi has no authority over the Senate.)

Recall Lavrentiy Beria infamous boast: "Show me the man, and I'll show you the crime". Please be aware, that the Democrats started the impeachment process at the very time Trump assumed office. They have been looking for a crime ever since. On Inauguration day, Jan. 20, 2017, the Washington Post reported: The campaign to impeach President Trump has Begun

"At the moment the new commander in chief was sworn in, a campaign to build public support for his impeachment went live at ImpeachDonaldTrumpNow.org, spearheaded by two liberal advocacy groups aiming to lay the groundwork for his eventual ejection from the White House."
 
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vba_php

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If Joe Biden was corrupt, and Trump got it investigated, is that not in the public interest, since you don't want to elect a corrupt President in 2020?
Jon,

Please tell me you're smart enough to realize that every politician in the world is corrupt? That's a fact of life, man. There are very few exceptions to the rule. I'm not sure who I can reference....Margarate Thatcher perhaps? Tony Blair? Angela Merkel of Germany? But if we're talking about the USA's leaders, they're seriously the worst of anybody out there because they're always in bed with the corporate idiots that are billionaaires. and to further prove my point Jon, I told you this would draw heat! =)

and let us not forget that the insanity of the technical world and the mass amount of confusion going on today is a direct result of American greed and corporations convincing countries that were already unsustainable that adopting capitalism was such a wonderful thing and can solve so many problems. and for what? to produce more revenue streams....what a freakin joke. :rolleyes:
 
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The_Doc_Man

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There you go again, vba_php - prattling on with your negativity. Oh, wait... isn't that what you accuse me of having?
 

vba_php

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There you go again, vba_php - prattling on with your negativity. Oh, wait... isn't that what you accuse me of having?
that's the Christian in me talking. the part of me that is in favor of poor people.
 
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Right now this poll stands at 50/50 to impeach, to be honest at the very least he is forging ahead with a right to try mentality regarding the COVID-19. I personally don't want to roll back any gains perceived or not by switching presidents because of personality issues.

Edit: I know the impeachment "trial" is over, but the fight continues to get him out of office at any cost.
 
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The_Doc_Man

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Actually, Trump WAS impeached. He wasn't convicted, because it's a two part process and the second part failed.
 

The_Doc_Man

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Usually I'm accused, not of being a little bit fried, but instead being more like half-baked.
 

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