The One True Religion (1 Viewer)

ShaneMan

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Rich said:
There is a difference between modern communications and translated stories that were stories to start with. Tell me why nothing of note has been added to the bible in nigh on 2,000 years?

but they aren't translated stories. Matthew, an eye witness; Mark, an eye witness; Luke, an eye witness; John, an eye witness; James, an eye witness; Most of the New Testament are letters written by Paul to the various churches he started; James, an eye witness; Psalms, written mostly by David and Moses; the list goes on. These writing were written by the men themselves and then the scribes copied from the original manuscripts. The flying noodle monster is a cute story but it can not make these factual claims. It is just a story.
 

Mile-O

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ShaneMan said:
but they aren't translated stories.

They most certainly are translated stories given that they have started off in Hebrew, and ended up in English by way of Coptic, Greek, Latin, and Middle English. It's along this route that many days and many nights has become forty days and forty nights; that fellow Jew has become neighbour; and so on.

Matthew, an eye witness; Mark, an eye witness; Luke, an eye witness; John, an eye witness; James, an eye witness;
They were not eye witnesses. Biblical historians place the writing of the gospels as independent pieces appearing at different times between 60CE and 150CE.


The flying noodle monster is a cute story but it can not make these factual claims.
The flying noodle monster has as much of a claim to existence as the stories of the Bible. Just because they were written down doesn't make them true. There's no physical proof of Jesus either.
 

ShaneMan

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SJ McAbney said:
They most certainly are translated stories given that they have started off in Hebrew, and ended up in English by way of Coptic, Greek, Latin, and Middle English. It's along this route that many days and many nights has become forty days and forty nights; that fellow Jew has become neighbour; and so on..

I understand that. My comments, I guess wrongly stated, were toward the word of mouth comments passed down through history and then some where along the way someone decided to write all this stuff down and do the best job of remembering how the story goes.


SJ McAbney said:
They were not eye witnesses. Biblical historians place the writing of the gospels as independent pieces appearing at different times between 60CE and 150CE.

How do you figure? Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, James, Timothy, all walked and talked with Jesus. That does not count as eye witnesses?




SJ McAbney said:
The flying noodle monster has as much of a claim to existence as the stories of the Bible. Just because they were written down doesn't make them true. There's no physical proof of Jesus either.

There is not physical proof of Jesus? Your kidding...right? Do you only stay studing in the areas that best fit into how you want things to be? The flying noodle may have as much claim, to you, but it does not have any where near the historical evidences that the Bible has. How do you account for so many people for so many years being tricked into this made up story? or the amount of very intelligent individuals that believe in this made up God, made up Jesus and their incredibly made up story?
 

lightray

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ShaneMan said:
There is not physical proof of Jesus? Your kidding...right? Do you only stay studing in the areas that best fit into how you want things to be? The flying noodle may have as much claim, to you, but it does not have any where near the historical evidences that the Bible has. How do you account for so many people for so many years being tricked into this made up story? or the amount of very intelligent individuals that believe in this made up God, made up Jesus and their incredibly made up story?
The mere fact that so many people believe in something, intelligent or otherwise is no basis for proof of existence. There were probably a lot of religions or belief systems going on in other parts of the world before and during the time of Jesus. I also don't think any ancient text has any more credence than say an ancient artifact of similar religious significance to the tribe that owned it.
 

ShaneMan

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lightray said:
The mere fact that so many people believe in something, intelligent or otherwise is no basis for proof of existence.

"no basis for proof" Maybe not in the way I think your referring to it but the point I'm trying to make is that this trick that has been concocted has got to be the best one anyone has ever come up with. The number of people who have bought this story, throughout history, has got to be an unbelievable number. How could so many people be so wrong?
 

lightray

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ShaneMan said:
"no basis for proof" Maybe not in the way I think your referring to it but the point I'm trying to make is that this trick that has been concocted has got to be the best one anyone has ever come up with. The number of people who have bought this story, throughout history, has got to be an unbelievable number. How could so many people be so wrong?
I think the thing about a belief is that as long as you are happy and getting along, what's the harm in it. In this case it doesn't have to be wrong if it's primarily doing good. Remember that there are millions in the world that don't believe in this doctrine, probably for the very reason that it doesn't stack up, for them. The bottom line seems to be that religion is a personal matter. I think it's because a person is placing a lot of trust in their beliefs, and they don't want to be thought of as stupid or silly for believing the way they do.
 
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Kraj

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ShaneMan said:
How could so many people be so wrong?
So what number is the cut-off point? Very large numbers of people have believed a lot of wrong things throughout history. Or on the flip side of the same coin, how can 600 million Hindus be wrong?
 

jsanders

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Kraj said:
So what number is the cut-off point? Very large numbers of people have believed a lot of wrong things throughout history. Or on the flip side of the same coin, how can 600 million Hindus be wrong?


Humans are not capable of understanding God, so we all try to see IT within the context of our culture.
 

lightray

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jsanders said:
Humans are not capable of understanding God
On what do you base this idea? Given that each religious sect, in most cases, has pretty much created their God, what's not to understand?

Did you have any response to my other post? .. about punishment?
 

jsanders

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lightray said:
Did you have any response to my other post? .. about punishment?


Been thinking about that, all I can say is that it seems to happen with more than just coincidental regularity.

lightray said:
On what do you base this idea? Given that each religious sect, in most cases, has pretty much created their God, what's not to understand?



When you say that God is created by the religion you are by your very words deciding that you will not have an open mind about the possibility of God existing.

Or at least that’s the impression.

Hence the reason I started this thread. Non believers seem to always use language designed to denigrate the act of believing.

Why do you suppose it is, that the most rigorous thinkers in history contemplated the existence of God; without the preconceived notion that IT could not exist.

If you approach it from that perspective, requiring explanation to conform to your sensibilities, than why discuss it at all?

Why not instead focus on, Economics, Physics, Biology, or something else, equally complicated?

Why religion?

I said earlier I am not religious, but I have no doubt that the power of God is an influence in my life. So why don’t I demand that people prove that I am mistaken.

Long before the discovery of oscillating magnetic fields, people would have said it was illogical to look at a picture of something a thousand miles away. Before Einstein proved that light was bent by gravitational fields, his contemporaries said bunk.
If for some reason I an able to connect to the power of God why should it be my responsibility to make it understandable to anyone else. I might as well be describing light to blind person.

I will tell you that it is easy to discover the power.

Just seek.
 
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lightray

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jsanders said:
When you say that God is created by the religion you are by your very words deciding that you will not have an open mind about the possibility of God existing.

Or at least that’s the impression.
I was actually try to point out an observation I had come to. I do in fact experience God, in my own way. I have in the past learnt and practiced reiki and other healing modalities. I have no explaination for why this works and why people feel the way they do after a session. It could very well be psychosamatic. However I believe otherwise.
This is not a forgone conclusion I continue to quest for more knowledge.
I wonder if you have seen the movie, "What the Bleep!" which was followed later with additional material (Director's cut sort of thing) by "What the Bleep, down the Rabbit Hole" Talked about reality at a quantum level, and how things can be affected by sheer observation.?
 
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lightray said:
Did you have any response to my other post? .. about punishment?
You'll find that many questions, remarks go unanswered or are met with abuse here, welcome to the club
 

lightray

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Rich said:
You'll find that many questions, remarks go unanswered or are met with abuse here, welcome to the club
I subscribe to the notion of "what goes around, comes around" or in biblical terms "as you sow, so shall ye reap" I think abuse just comes out of fear, it's always seems to be about the one trying to make the most noise. I'm fine with all that. thanks all the same, Rich :)
 

ShaneMan

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Kraj said:
So what number is the cut-off point? Very large numbers of people have believed a lot of wrong things throughout history. Or on the flip side of the same coin, how can 600 million Hindus be wrong?

I see what your saying, Kraj. I guess in the late hours of the evening, I came up with a bad example. My bad. Scratch this one. *note to self, don't try using this as an example, in the future, cause it doesn't hold water. end note*
 

jsanders

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Rich said:
You'll find that many questions, remarks go unanswered or are met with abuse here, welcome to the club
Who is abusing him?
 

TessB

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Got to reading this thread..... hung in there until about page 7.
:)

Funny thing though.... when I read the initial post, I had no idea it was bashing atheism..... LOL... it sounded like a pretty good deal to me and I was all ready to sign up!
 

lightray

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TessB said:
Funny thing though.... when I read the initial post, I had no idea it was bashing atheism..... LOL... it sounded like a pretty good deal to me and I was all ready to sign up!
I was wondering where the compromise was then?:confused:
 

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ShaneMan said:
I see what your saying, Kraj. I guess in the late hours of the evening, I came up with a bad example. My bad. Scratch this one. *note to self, don't try using this as an example, in the future, cause it doesn't hold water. end note*

Shane:

I'm just curious if you got that argument from McDowell. Josh McDowell uses that type of thinking all the time. One of his "best" arguments is "the Apostles wouldn't have allowed themselves to be martyred had they not believed in the resurrection"

Using this line of thinking, McDowell completely ignores that almost every known religion has people who have given their lives for their religion. THis includes many who gave their lives to be tortured and burned NOT to embrace Christianity. This is the type of typical "let's ignore all reality" argument posited by McDowell.

I only raise his name because you mentioned him earlier. I know someone who was Christian for 11 years and became non-Christian when she realized how poorly researched his "Proofs" are.

And by the way, you mentioned that the Gospels were written by eyewitnesses. I guess you missed the first verse in Luke where he says clearly otherwise.

SHADOW
 

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