The Virus that came from China. (1 Viewer)

deletedT

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This morning I was listening to the morning news in TV while I was preparing to go and start another busy day, .
Listening to a part of President Trump's yesterday speech, I was thinking he will never change. But then I was shocked when I heard him saying : The virus that came from China.
I don't know how a native English speaker thinks, but for us who English is our second or third language, there's a huge difference between Made By and Came from.
He used to call it Chinese Virus and it struck us as made by, originated by or produced by China. And it made them responsible for what they did to the world.
Now if he says Came From, it simply means that they happened to be the first to be infected and it doesn't make them responsible for that.
My wife smiled and said : Now that he's only several months away from the election, he's more politically protective.

To be true I personally don't like President Trump (and I apologize to all his supporters who read this), but I only respected him for being straight and standing strong for his goals. I used to believe he'll stand his ground no matter what. But if he's going to change for political reasons or whatever else, for me, he's another one standing in that long line of corrupted politicians who do or say anything to keep their seats.
 
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Isaac

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but if he wants to advance his goals, and the only possibility of doing that is to win re-election, then isn't the most honest and true thing he can do for himself and his supporters whatever it takes to do that? and if what it took was correcting his speech a little bit to suit a larger audience, then why not? This is politics. Occasionally sacrificing a smaller goal for a bigger goal.

his poll numbers are really bad right now and so he is worried and he is trying to take maybe what seemed to be very small steps to correct them somewhat. I personally think that he'll be okay and might well win, because people will be so sick of the movement that's happening right now over the next 4 months. Given the fact that their trajectory over just three to five weeks has been fairly extreme, I can only imagine what people's perception will be after 4 months.

let me ask you something fairly direct and I hope you don't mind. This is the second time that you've posted something that indicates a level of concern that China is not being held fully responsible. given the fact that you don't start a large number of threads but you started this twice in the past few months, I was wondering if this issue is a high level of concern for you. my wife has several Japanese friends and their feelings generally toward China and Chinese people are pretty strong and negative. Is this common in Japan and does it apply to you? This is not an accusation just a question and wanting to understand better.
 

deletedT

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but if he wants to advance his goals, and the only possibility of doing that is to win re-election, then isn't the most honest and true thing he can do for himself and his supporters whatever it takes to do that? and if what it took was correcting his speech a little bit to suit a larger audience, then why not? This is politics. Occasionally sacrificing a smaller goal for a bigger goal.
If he wants to win a larger audience, I think he should be softer with media and the way he talks to others.
Changing the facts and his belief just to win the election, is not what I support. If he really changed his mind and believes there may be a chance that China didn't spread the virus, I expect him to announce it officially and declare that new evidences show there may be other possibilities. Changing color over night without any explanation is not something that attracts me.


let me ask you something fairly direct and I hope you don't mind. This is the second time that you've posted something that indicates a level of concern that China is not being held fully responsible. given the fact that you don't start a large number of threads but you started this twice in the past few months, I was wondering if this issue is a high level of concern for you. my wife has several Japanese friends and their feelings generally toward China and Chinese people are pretty strong and negative. Is this common in Japan and does it apply to you? This is not an accusation just a question and wanting to understand better.
I had to think over your question for a while. I had to ask myself the same question before replying.
Maybe I have to write a book to explain this. But in short :

We have very strict rules and manners that have to be kept in public. And we have a large number of tourists from China who come here and behave what we can not accept in public. Most of us try to stay away and not see what they're doing in our cities and shopping centers. I don't want to go through details but I'm sure you won't like seeing a tourist drawing a knife out of his pocket and carving his girl friends name on a monument that is a part of the history of your country. I also assume you can not accept seeing a group of them buy their lunch from a convenience store and sit in the middle of a train station to have lunch, causing troubles for others. They even don't know why we have trash boxes everywhere over our cities. When a group of them leaves a place, it's just like a storm has struck. They talk loudly, they use their mobiles to make calls to others in our train, they shout at each other in buses, they smoke in restricted areas, and they think they are allowed to pee anywhere they like. Just try to use a toilet in a shopping center or a historical monument after them.
They don't follow traffic rules in driving, they change line anywhere they want, they don't use turn signal, they honk rapidly. They don't even use crosswalks. They simply cross the streets anywhere anytime.

There's no end to the lists I can give you. So, as a manner and social behavior point of view, I can say most of us don't approve what they are doing to our culture and cities.

But my concern about Corona Virus has nothing to do with that. I simply think they were working on Corona Virus and I have seen several documentaries that shows and proves that scientists from US and France have been insisting and asking China to use Level 4 security for labs working on Corona Virus from at least 5 years ago and they rejected it.
Now that it's out of control, they are trying to change the fact. I think there's no need to explain how they first tried to manipulate W.H.O .
It's been said enough.

I still remember your reply in other thread concerning this. I know you are kind and I also know you forgive, just like the majority of our people who think it doesn't matter how and who started this. Let's think how to control it.
But I think if we pass it by and don't react against the reasons, we would have more of this coming for us in feature.

To answer your question in short, yes most of our people don't like their behavior and public manners. But there are very few of us who believe they must be held responsible for Corona virus.
 

Micron

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Personally, I think this is all semantics. Considering who said it, "From China" or "Made by China" is the same as the tomato thing:
toe-may-toe / toe-mah-toe.
When have you ever known DJT to be clear, concise or truthful about anything, especially when he's always 'shooting from the lip' ?
 

The_Doc_Man

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They don't follow traffic rules in driving, they change line anywhere they want, they don't use turn signal, they honk rapidly. They don't even use crosswalks. They simply cross the streets anywhere anytime.

Are you sure those weren't Louisiana drivers?
 

Steve R.

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Listening to a part of President Trump's yesterday speech, I was thinking he will never change. But then I was shocked when I heard him saying : The virus that came from China.

...

To be true I personally don't like President Trump (and I apologize to all his supporters who read this), but I only respected him for being straight and standing strong for his goals. I used to believe he'll stand his ground no matter what. But if he's going to change for political reasons or whatever else, for me, he's another one standing in that long line of corrupted politicians who do or say anything to keep their seats.

Personally, I think this is all semantics.
Language is being corrupted by one's political viewpoint. Think Orwell's 1984 Newspeak. Those political viewpoints are being used to either, with malice, to purposely misinterpret or redefine what a speaker has said. The purpose behind this verbal slight-of-hand is to imply that the speaker has made some-sort of offensive and/or ignorant remark so that the speaker can be condemned.

For example, on another website, I had used the word "hysterical". I was immediately castigated for that as being a misogynistic type statement despite the fact that the dictionary definition of "hysterical" carries no such "color". The purpose of this castigation, by a person who appears to be supporting politically correct reinterpretation of words, was to negate my comment concerning the mass hysteria currently sweeping this country (USA). Consequently, the the discussion of mass hysteria was hijacked to become a semantic squabble over the use of the word "hysteria".

My example is a small example, but take the big case of Trump who is this Nation's President. Following Trump's July 4th speeches, the liberal media immediately pounced on his speeches as being predicatively divisive and to be condemned. The media was purposely and with malice seeking to misinterpret or redefine what Trump has said. As listeners to any analysis of a speech and/or article written, we need to be aware that those reporting may have their own agenda to sabotage the speaker/writer.
 

Uncle Gizmo

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I personally think that he'll be okay and might well win,

Shrewd, manipulative, bully, are words that form in my mind when ask myself what I think about Trump. Stupid, ignorant, are a couple of others. But I must say I like Trump, I think he plays the game well.

As to whether he should be your American president, well you have a democracy, and any one of your citizens Can Be president. Trump is proof that your system works well!

I don't think Trump wanted to be president, I think he wanted the "office of presidency" and all of the pomp and ceremony that goes with it, but the actual job, no, I don't think he had any idea what it would be like.

Mind you I doubt very much if any of your would be presidents realised beforehand what was involved, before they took office.
 

Isaac

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@Tera
Thanks much for your sincere and thought out reply, I really appreciate as it helps me understand those issues in your part of the world and I like to learn how things really are. Before posting, I thought it was probably something like that and I completely understand. There are some troublemakers in every country whose behavior is obnoxious or worse, so I can appreciate what you have described. When your own country is one of the cleanest, most polite, safest and respected places in the world--you want to keep it that way and it hurts when outsiders or any bad element behaves destructively to such a beautiful environment.

As a separate note, recall that even in my earlier posts, it wasn't as much a matter of forgiving as it was just timing - I wasn't sure it was a good idea at that time to be focusing on blame, since the situation was urgent to be solved. Much like an auto accident with a critically injured on side of the road it is time to save a life and not argue about who caused crash. But, as time goes on, I am supportive of the idea of eventually holding anyone responsible who either caused or exacerbated this deadly problem.

I read this morning that China have reported a case of bubonic plague now. Personally I think the whole world should stick to the basics when it comes to what is and isn't food from animals: eat Cows, Pigs, Chicken, & Seafood. (Have I missed anything major? Probably, I can't remember). At the risk of over-generalizing, it seems to me that anywhere where eating other wild animals is common seems to be like playing with fire when it comes to diseases.

Then you have places like where my wife's family is from in Mexico--they eat many more parts of the cow than is common here. But at least the result of that has more to do with just the eater getting sick. Not spreading new & creative diseases.
 

AccessBlaster

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As to whether he should be your American president, well you have a democracy, and any one of your citizens Can Be president. Trump is proof that your system works well!
Not a pure democracy.
Key Takeaways: Republic vs. Democracy
  • Republics and democracies both provide a political system in which citizens are represented by elected officials who are sworn to protect their interests.
  • In a pure democracy, laws are made directly by the voting majority leaving the rights of the minority largely unprotected.
  • In a republic, laws are made by representatives chosen the people and must comply with a constitution that specifically protects the rights of the minority from the will of the majority.
  • The United States, while basically a republic, is best described as a “representative democracy.”
 

Isaac

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Shrewd, manipulative, bully, are words that form in my mind when ask myself what I think about Trump. Stupid, ignorant, are a couple of others. But I must say I like Trump, I think he plays the game well.

As to whether he should be your American president, well you have a democracy, and any one of your citizens Can Be president. Trump is proof that your system works well!

I don't think Trump wanted to be president, I think he wanted the "office of presidency" and all of the pomp and ceremony that goes with it, but the actual job, no, I don't think he had any idea what it would be like.

Mind you I doubt very much if any of your would be presidents realised beforehand what was involved, before they took office.
I think I agree with a majority of what you have said. I was a late comer to the camp of Trump supporters. Originally I strongly disliked him for the first few years (starting with the 1 full year of campaigning). But eventually I was forced to admit that whether I like him or not, There is no (currently) way to advance Republican, conservative ideas against the flow of leftist cr@p right now other than him. So I can vote for a philosophy that I mostly agree with (while disliking the person & some things he stands for), or I can vote for a philosophy that I 80% disagree with. The former is the logical choice.
 

The_Doc_Man

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Isaac, I am reminded of the old phrase, "The devil you know rather than the devil you don't." Except that we know a little about avaricious Sleepy Joe.
 

gcoaster

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Made By and Came from.

Made By
Creation was made by God, All things where created through Jesus Christ.

Came from.
We Came From rocks (LOL -adult fairy-tale)


viruses are not where not created by man but manipulated
Ok, The sarscov2 Came From originated from a Lab in China, by scientists for biological warfare.
 

zfar

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Carefully chosen words. Those who want to follow his line that it was made by China will still hear "made in china". His speech team is hoping that his detractors will be weakened by those hearing his admission that it wasn't made in China but just came from there.
 

The_Doc_Man

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@gcoaster, considering the number of people who act like they have rocks in their head, I'm voting for "came from."

But then, I never really cared for fairy tales that much anyway.
 

Micron

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Getting pedantic about anything that DJT says is a waste of time. I just consider where it comes from, which makes the interpretation easy.
 

deletedT

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Creation was made by God, All things where created through Jesus Christ
Apparently human is creating all of what GOD forgot to create:

To be clear again, I don’t insist of Corona Virus being made/manipulated or whatever else by China.
I didn’t like that President Trump changed over night without clearing why or any explanation. To me it was like a retreat.
 
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Micron

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I didn’t like that President Trump changed over night without clearing why or any explanation.
Tera, you're assuming he thinks before he speaks or that he follows a party policy. It's just tomayto tomahto like I said.
 

Isaac

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I saw him in a mask today too, on the TV.
 

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