This is the craziest thing I have ever seen!!! (1 Viewer)

[Noreene Patrick]

I was given a Dell computer about 6 months ago..worked fine before I got it and worked fine with no problems at my house until about 3 weeks ago..First, it said keyboard failure but went right on and booted up. Then one day, it wouldnt boot past the Dell screen (1st screen). So, I bought a new keyboard, no difference..plugged keyboard into different usb, would not boot.

Was going to thrown the Dell away. Took it down, bought a new computer, plugged it in same outlet and worked fine for about a week, then bamm, did the same thing that the Dell did, would not boot up past the 1st screen. Changed to another electrical outlet, worked fine. Will not work all the time in the old outlet but for the past 2-3 weeks it hasnt hestitated to boot where it is now in this outlet.

So, I plugged up the Dell again in another outlet and viola!! it worked. Gave it to my daughter in law.

She took her old computer she had about 8 years down (the only reason she wanted another computer was because she had Windows Milleniamun), plugged up the Dell in the same outlet and it worked fine. Until today..it did the same thing at her house. Wouldnt boot past the 1st screen. She took it to the living room, plugged it up and it worked..wouldnt work under any circumstance in the normal computer outlet she has always used.

What in the world is going on? Surely, if it is a virus it wouldnt affect the electrical outlet?!!!

Please help!!!

 

[ajetrumpet]

That's an interesting predicament Noreene. Personally, I doubt you'll get an answer to it.

 

[Noreene Patrick]

Hi, ajetrumpet..

Since I have asked you SO many questions, I posted my question on the forum.

Why do you think I wont get an answer? Is it that crazy?

 

[ajetrumpet]

Yep. It's that crazy. It doesn't make much sense to me, and I've got A LOT of experience with outlets.

 

[Noreene Patrick]

Well, both outlets had the Dell plugged in, so could a virus do something like that? Neither of us had any problem with our computers working until the Dell came along. But the Dell worked without a hitch for me for 6 months.

Maybe someone can shed some light..

Thanks Adam, you have always been a tremendous help to me.

 

[ajetrumpet]

Well...getting hitched to a computer will probably cause it to be depressed. If I was depressed, I would shut off too. LOL!

I hope someone can answer this for you...

 

[Noreene Patrick]

Thanks Adam...I have to assume you are not married? Some days marriage can be depressing..some days it's not.

I appreciate your wanting to help.

Maybe this is a question for an electrician?

Someone, anyone, do you have an answer?

 

[boblarson]

Have the outlet checked to see if it is wired correctly. It is possible that it isn't and therefore could be causing problems. As for why it might work and then not - it is a bit of a mystery. But having an electrician check the outlet might be a good thing anyway.

 

[georgedwilkinson]

Actually, if the outlet is wired incorrectly, it could impact the electronics (i.e. the power supply) in ways that may make the write voltage on the disk drive a little too low. If the write voltage is low, the magnetic domains on the magnetic media will be weaker, resulting in potential problems reading those domains, especially if the read voltage is low (like the problem that could be caused by having a low voltage on the power supply which could be caused by a bad outlet).

Another possibility is that the badly wired outlet caused electrons to flow in ways the power supply (or other components) was/were not designed for, reducing the value of the components (resistors, capacitors, diodes, ics, etc.) by a slight amount, causing erratic behavior.

I used to see all kinds of crazy stuff like this when I was a Field Engineer. When my clients would get thier wiring fixed at my insistence and purchase the appropriate power management devices, the problems magically disappeared.

 

[boblarson]

Yeah, George - Although I didn't know the complete technical details, with my experience with Pro Audio systems (P.A., guitar amps, etc.) I knew that incorrect wiring can be bad. In the Pro Audio realm, it not only is bad for the electronics, but opens up the possibility of ground loops which result in hum.

So thanks for the more technical explanation.

 

[Noreene Patrick]

Thanks so much for the answers...but, if the wiring was incorrect in one outlet, why will it boot up in another? Immediately.

And, these outlets always worked with other computers. Is the Dell power supply so different or requires so much more power than normal computers? I know the power supply on the Dell is a HUGE box that I have not seen with any other computer. Could two houses having used the same computer all of a sudden have the same electrical problems, 30 miles away? Could the wiring on the Dell have caused the electrical outlet problem in some way? Why did it work fine for 6 months for me and 3 weeks for my daughter in law without a problem?

Also, what kind of power management devices are you talking about?

I know these are a lot of questions, but no one seems to have an answer but this forum...any help would be GREATLY appreciated.

Noreene

 

[Uncle Gizmo]

Basically what you've got is an intermittent fault, it could be anything causing it, from a cracked circuit board, to a loose connection somewhere.

Intermittent faults are notoriously difficult to isolate, and could take many hours, unless of course you get lucky! You have obviously been very unlucky so far, so you are probably due a spell of good luck! Good luck and cheers from me Tony.

 

[Banana]

I'd bet on George's and Tony's explanation.

I live in a house with ancient wiring which seems to work OK, but in actuality did nasty thing to both my iMac's power supply and my old Dell lappy's power adaptor. I've had iMac's power supply replaced twice, my Dell's adaptor five times. (Good thing it was all covered by respective warranty)

Turns out that just because I can plug it in and power it up, doesn't mean it's A-OK; it's possible to have brownout, which George alluded earlier, that can wreak havoc on sensitive eletronic, and that is still true even if you have surge protector (I did). I have since used a UPS in the same outlet and now iMac and the new MacBook Pro works quite smoothly all times I've had UPS (almost more than half a year). I've since forbidden any plugging in any sensitive electronic devices anywhere else but the UPS.

Surge protectors can protect you from spikes in current, but not when there's not enough juice, and this is what burned out everything, including those fancy twirly energy-saving bulbs (they lasts a few months; if they live to a year, I'm very lucky)

Hmm.. now this just convinces me that I should be really giving my landlord the finger very soon. Ah, the joys of cheap rents!

 

[georgedwilkinson]

The problem with power improvement devices (surge protectors, UPSs, line conditioners) is that if the wiring is messed up (ground and neutral tied together or neutral-hot reversed, for instance), it can nullify the good that comes from having the devices and you can still end up with spikes, faults, ground loops, etc. That can lead to component degradation and intermittent good/bad behavior (I did mention that earlier, right?).

 

[Banana]

Interesting, I didn't realize that this would be the case. I'd have thought that having a UPS was analogous to sandboxing because if anything bad happens behind the UPS, the battery switch in, so the plugged components see no changes in current at all (at least until UPS fails or runs out of battery juice) so one could plug a UPS in the world's most borked wiring and still work.

Too bad.

 

[Noreene Patrick]

I live in an older house. Never had this problem with anything else. My daughter in law lives in a trailer (wired with 14 gauge wire) and never had this problem with anything either.

Now, having said that..could it be that the outlet that I had the Dell plugged in went bad and corrupted the power supply and this caused the same problem at my daughter in laws house? The thing that is crazy is..it will work for a while in another outlet but soon that outlet will do the same thing. It's like it corrupts the outlet or something.

And if I decided to buy a UPS, what in the world do I look for when ready to purchase?

Ya'll are so good to give us some answers... no one else can.

Thanks, Noreene

 

[Banana]

To be clear, I wouldn't blame outlet; it's just a bunch of dumb copper wires sprouting off extra electrons; it couldn't do anything else.

I'd suspect something's wrong with power supply. I recall vaguely about Dell building in a safety check in the power supply that causes it to shut down if it decides that the source isn't stable. It's possible that this is the factor that causes it to behaves weirdly...

 

[georgedwilkinson]

A UPS is probably the way to go for making sure you have good power going to the computer. It is much more forgiving of bad power in (within reason).

I also wouldn't worry as much about a trailer's (mis) wiring since they are pretty uniform in their construction. The biggest worry is with wiring in older houses...you just don't know what you've got and electricians used to be pretty lazy about tying ground and neutral together (one of the biggest complaints).

Since the advent of a computer in every home, most electricians have finally "got" it (ground and neutral are different) and these problems are rare.

 

[Noreene Patrick]

Thanks so much, guys...so if I look for a UPS what do I need it to be? A certain type, power, what? You can tell how dumb I am about electronics!!

 

[boblarson]

Before you start looking for an UPS I would make sure to look for an electrician to check the wiring. Find out if there's a problem because the UPS isn't going to be the fix if you still have a problem. It is good to get one though and APC is one we've always used at various jobs I've had.