Obama's Mistaken and Incromprehensible ISIS Strategy

[Alc]

p.s. I might add that not all Muslims are Islamist but all Islamist are Muslims. 99.8% of all the worlds terrorist attacks have come from Islamist.

What's this figure based On?
Remember, 86.7% of all quoted statistics are made up on the spot.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/non-mu...0-of-all-terrorist-attacks-in-america/5333619

http://metro.co.uk/2015/01/15/the-n...igiously-motivated-will-surprise-you-5023616/

 

[Frothingslosh]

ALC:

1) I know you aren't Islamophobic. My grief (even my reductio ad absurdum in post 39 above) is with the folks who keep trying to paint Islam as being pure evil due to certain Qu'ran passages while giving Christianity a bye despite the Bible also calling for not only the deaths of all unbelievers, but for the deaths of any city, town, or village HARBORING unbelievers. "But it's different when I do it" is hypocrisy, nothing more.

2) I'm pretty sure the Troubles alone prove Blade made up his BS statistics on the spot, without even having to go into all the terrorism world-wide conducted by non-Muslims. Blade is speaking out of terror and ignorance, nothing more. It's just a shame his fear, hatred, and intolerance are so widespread.

 

[Alc]

For all I know, the figure may be correct BUT it may well be one of those like an average where it's extremely misleading. For example, if most terrorist attacks take place in the middle east (no idea if this is the case) then it might be true that 95% of all terrorist attacks take place in countries with above a certain number of camels. This doesn't prove a cause and effect between the two.

Likewise, if all ISIS attacks are to counted as terrorism, then this will skew the percentage of attacks by Muslims, even though the vast majority of these attacks have been concentrated within a small region.

 

[Steve R.]

At the risk of repeating myself, the point was that your Bibe that you two defend so fervently as the source of all that is good has all SORTS of commands to kill people, just like the Qu'ran, and that it's just as easy to take those commands and wave them around to prove that the Bible calls for all sorts of murder (including the murders of ALL non-Christians) as it was for Blade to do the same with the Qu'ran. That if taking those verses, alone, with no context or history, means Muslims and their religion are evil, then by that very logic, the same applies to Christians and Christianity.

My counter point (that you apparently refuse to accept) is that you are using the wrong reference; the Old Testament. This is a case of inappropriate comparison (apples and oranges). It is unreasonable to cite the Old Testament in-order to assert that Christians have "ridiculous literal" interpretations. The Old Testament, while part of the Bible, is "obsolete" within the context of this discussion (you note "context or history") since the Old Testament pre-dates Christianity and does not lay-out Christian philosophy. I also stated that if you can find "ridiculous literal" phrases (including any phrases that imply death to non-Christians) in the New Testament that it would would be appropriate for you to cite them. If you can do that, then you have made your point.

 

[Alc]

My counter point (that you apparently refuse to accept) is that you are using the wrong reference; the Old Testament. This is a case of inappropriate comparison (apples and oranges). It is unreasonable to cite the Old Testament in-order to assert that Christians have "ridiculous literal" interpretations. The Old Testament, while part of the Bible, is "obsolete" within the context of this discussion .

BladeRunner is an admitted and vocal Christian and says, in post #37 of this thread:
"The OT is not dead and should not be because "Everything that is concealed in the OT is revealed in the NT and everything that is concealed in the NT is revealed in the OT. IN fact, Jesus is talked about on just about every page of the OT."
If he believes it's still a valid source of ideas, why can't it be included in the discussion?

 

[Steve R.]

BladeRunner is an admitted and vocal Christian and says, in post #37 of this thread:
"The OT is not dead and should not be because "Everything that is concealed in the OT is revealed in the NT and everything that is concealed in the NT is revealed in the OT. IN fact, Jesus is talked about on just about every page of the OT."
If he believes it's still a valid source of ideas, why can't it be included in the discussion?

You have a valid point there. Thanks for your clarity. I will accept.

 

[Bladerunner]

What's this figure based On?
Remember, 86.7% of all quoted statistics are made up on the spot.

The links yoiu gave are from libs. ALC.....let me ask you something.......

Have all you libs out there thought about how our letting in Islamic Muslims and syrian refugees into our county will affect the LGBT community. In essence you are going to be letting in thousands of Homophobes who have no tolerance. Have you ever thought about asking them how they feel.

http://chersonandmolschky.com/2015/04/13/islamic-terrorism-japan/

http://www.wnd.com/2015/01/u-n-also-wont-call-paris-attack-islamic/

here you go,,, get your own % since you don't believe mine. Of course I called a spade a spade.

http://www.start.umd.edu/gtd/search...success=yes&casualties_type=b&casualties_max=


Have a good time???

Blade

 

[Bladerunner]

You have a valid point there. Thanks for your clarity. I will accept.

Steve R....I did not mean to step on any toes here. Having read you 'last' post before this one, I realized I did not understand what you were saying. my Apologies.

Having said that. the OT gives a prophecy of Jesus's arrival in Jerusalem, his death and resurrection many years before it happened. It also speaks of the salvation he will bring with him, thereby upholding the main Christian value, Jesus Christ died on the Cross for our sins.

Have a blessed day

Blade

 

[Alc]

The links yoiu gave are from libs.

No idea what this is based on.
One article is based on data from Europol (the link is in the article).
The other was written by an extremely right-leaning professor who I can only apologise for including, but who should have been right up your street. On reading more on that site, it has no more credibility than WND (see below) and I should have read it more closely before referencing it.

Have all you libs out there thought about how our letting in Islamic Muslims and syrian refugees into our county will affect the LGBT community. In essence you are going to be letting in thousands of Homophobes who have no tolerance. Have you ever thought about asking them how they feel.

Don't, for one second, try to pretend any concern for that community. If it were left to Christian extremists, they'd all be keeping their sexuality a secret for fear of being sent to camps to be 'cured'. As far as the refugees making a difference to them goes, in the US we're talking about thousands diluted into a country of millions. Firstly, even if they were all as firmly intolerable as the extreme right would have us believe, they're hardly going to be in the majority and so are unlikely to be a threat to gay people. Secondly, they will have the common enemy of intolerant, right wing bigots to fear. This alone may help them form some bond?

http://chersonandmolschky.com/2015/04/13/islamic-terrorism-japan/

One glance at the comments below this article reveals exactly why you favoured it. Your real name isn't Kenny, is it?

http://www.wnd.com/2015/01/u-n-also-wont-call-paris-attack-islamic/

This link is about the Paris attacks, specifically.
1) I don't think anyone is disputing the fact that 100% of the terrorist attacks carried out in Paris in the last week were done by Muslim extremists.
2) The article is from WND, an extremist site that
'...espouses a fundamentalistChristian, creationist view of the world, and regularly engages in racist attacks against African-Americans. Its political leanings are right-wing, pro-"Christian right,"'
quote from http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/WND

here you go,,, get your own % since you don't believe mine. Of course I called a spade a spade.

http://www.start.umd.edu/gtd/search...success=yes&casualties_type=b&casualties_max=

This one is blocked by work's internet filters, so I can't comment.

 

[Frothingslosh]

At this point, Steve, I can only think you're deliberately refusing to understand the point I was trying to make. No one using this site can be that stupid legitimately.

I have stated repeatedly that I was using those quotes that the Bible can be mined for out-of-context quotes proving it to be 'evil' just as easily as the Qu'ran. You repeatedly insist that the Old Testament is off-limits because Jesus, yet that is effectively the same defense you refuse to accept from Muslims: that the quotes in question are a) taken out of context, and b) ignored by the overwhelming majority of Muslims because those quotes represent behavior that is abhorrent to civilized society, just as the Bible's injunction to slaughter every resident living in any community with non-Christians is ignored.

Saying that you can cherry-pick the Qu'ran like that while demanding that the Bible not be treated the same is pure hypocrisy, regardless of whether or not you 'allow' the point to be made, and only shows that you have no intention of handling this discussion honestly, much less fairly.

 

[Bladerunner]

Don't, for one second, try to pretend any concern for that community. If it were left to Christian extremists, they'd all be keeping their sexuality a secret for fear of being sent to camps to be 'cured'. As far as the refugees making a difference to them goes, in the US we're talking about thousands diluted into a country of millions. Firstly, even if they were all as firmly intolerable as the extreme right would have us believe, they're hardly going to be in the majority and so are unlikely to be a threat to gay people. Secondly, they will have the common enemy of intolerant, right wing bigots to fear. This alone may help them form some bond?

Sure I care about them,,,they are human beings..... etc. I am sorry you doubt that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

At some point in this post you make reference to 'Europo'. Are they not Liberal...Hell everything over there is liberal,,,, that is why people are getting killed.... 'They have to do the RIGHT thing and let people (Unknown people ) in so they can feeeeeeeel goooood about themselves.

we have mentality over here and it is getting stronger every day. I see now where they are teaching Islam in some TN schools. The only problem, the books tell nothing but lies (how peaceful it is) about the Islam religion. Hmmmmmmmmmmm!

Blade

 

[Frothingslosh]

Blade, you just do not understand even the most basic concept behind 'compassion', do you?

You don't refuse to help people in need just because one belief or another is one you personally object to. Those refugees need help, and America can help a LOT of them. It doesn't matter that many of them may be homophobic, that many of them may actually hate Christians, that many of them almost certainly hate white people, that many of them hate Hindus, or that many of them think our society is hopelessly corrupt. Each of those hatreds are mirrored by many already part of our society - very much including you - and adding a few thousand more people to a nation of over 300 million won't suddenly cause the US to start slaughtering every LGBT person inside the borders.

Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.

"Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

Nowhere in there does it say "who think just like me". Nor can I find anything of the sort in the Constitution, the Declaration of Independence, or the Federalist Papers. Nowhere in American or International law does it state that nations may only admit those who already think precisely the same way as American liberals.

Blade, the differences in ideology that have terrified you into your hatred of anyone who doesn't think identically to you are honestly what American freedom is supposed to be about. Freedom of thought has always been our greatest strength, no matter how desperately you and your ilk have opposed it.

 

[Frothingslosh]

'They have to do the RIGHT thing and let people (Unknown people ) in so they can feeeeeeeel goooood about themselves.

And this right here says everything anyone will ever need to know about you.

We do the right thing because it's the right thing.

You demand we join in your evil because you're scared.

 

[Alc]

Sure I care about them,,,they are human beings..... etc. I am sorry you doubt that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't doubt it (over the top exclamation marks or not). I KNOW you don't. Every anti-gay, they-shouldn't-get-married, they're-not-normal comment I've ever heard has come from a right-wing, often Christian extremist. If you are now claiming to be a supporter of gay rights, how does that fit in with the rest of the intolerant vitriol you've been spouting?

At some point in this post you make reference to 'Europo'. Are they not Liberal...Hell everything over there is liberal,,,, that is why people are getting killed

Starting to suspect you're a troll and I'm falling for it. Either that you genuinely know nothing at all about life outside the US. Europol (not Europo) is a law enforcement agency https://www.europol.europa.eu/ covering Europe. The police! If you're seriously suggesting that any police force anywhere tends to be more left than right wing, I can only imagine you've never had any dealings with them.

we have mentality over here and it is getting stronger every day.

Never a truer word spoken, and some of you moreso than others.

I see now where they are teaching Islam in some TN schools. The only problem, the books tell nothing but lies (how peaceful it is) about the Islam religion. Hmmmmmmmmmmm!

Once again, not true. Comes from another WND article, so by definition written from a misleading, right wing extremist viewpoint.
As this article explains http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/islam.asp
"As part of their social studies curriculum, Grade 7 pupils throughout California do study ancient Muslim cultures and the impact of Islam on world history, but only as one of eleven units that comprise that year's social studies course, not as a special indoctrination into a particular religion as the ASN article presents it. "
Why not just claim that Muslims eat babies and be done with it?
The WND readers would fall for it.

 

[Frothingslosh]

Face it, ALC, Bladerunner longs for the good old days of a police state. Perhaps Stalinist USSR would have been more his taste, but based on his behavior, I think he'd fit right in among the Third Reich. Gays, liberals, and intellectuals were all handled just how he has has repeatedly said he'd like to see happen, and no one dared contradict the ultra-conservative national government.

 

[Alc]

Face it, ALC, Bladerunner longs for the good old days of a police state. Perhaps Stalinist USSR would have been more his taste, but based on his behavior, I think he'd fit right in among the Third Reich. Gays, liberals, and intellectuals were all handled just how he has has repeatedly said he'd like to see happen, and no one dared contradict the ultra-conservative national government.

Yes, the USSR didn't offer the chance to justify selfishness and prejudice behind religion, so I don't think he'd have fit in there. They made no attempt to pretend that they would like everyone, were it not for a story book saying that they shouldn't. It was a more "transparent" form of intolerance, for want of a better word. Why do we hate you? Because we do, that's why.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Blade might have liked the WWII USSR but he also might have been happy with the Third Reich since

1. Their soldiers wore belt buckles saying "Gott mit uns" (God {is} with us). I mean, come on, how religious is THAT?

2. They condemned a LOT of undesirables - so many that it was almost a guarantee that they had condemned SOMEONE you didn't like.

3. They didn't just condemn - they killed, which was of course the "Ultimate Solution" to their problem.

I know that the Third Reich eliminated Jews, gypsies, gays, 7th-day Adventists, and many crippled folks. (Don't have an exact breakdown on percentages, but the total killed was > 6 million.)

Blade, you MUST understand that this comparison is due to your intractable nature, not necessarily due to you wearing a uniform with a fylfot symbol (in German, "swastika") and sporting a very narrow mustache. It might hurt you to be compared in this way, but you show EXACTLY the same intractability as many of the German High Command from WWII including the Waffen SS. If the (fanatically dedicated) shoe fits, wear it...

I am NOT calling you a Nazi. I'm calling you a person whose open-mindedness appears to be commensurate with WWII Nazis. There is a difference.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Frothy:

Nowhere in there does it say "who think just like me". Nor can I find anything of the sort in the Constitution, the Declaration of Independence, or the Federalist Papers. Nowhere in American or International law does it state that nations may only admit those who already think precisely the same way as American liberals.

In fact, the USA has this pesky little amendment that says we CANNOT create laws that discriminate against people because of Race, Creed, National Origin, Gender, etc. Now if we could just amend that ONE MORE TIME to include "Gender Identity." Or get SCOTUS to read "Gender" broadly enough to imply it.

 

[Frothingslosh]

Frothy:



In fact, the USA has this pesky little amendment that says we CANNOT create laws that discriminate against people because of Race, Creed, National Origin, Gender, etc. Now if we could just amend that ONE MORE TIME to include "Gender Identity." Or get SCOTUS to read "Gender" broadly enough to imply it.

Amen to that, Doc.

 

[Vassago]

Referring to an earlier post, Muslim and Islamist are EXACTLY the same thing since by definition, a Muslim is someone who submits to Islamic beliefs. There is no some of this are this and all of this are this. They are one and the same, just different words for the same definition.