1st Access Project (1 Viewer)

[JaybeeTheBeefy]

Hi all, newb here both to this forum and to Access front ends, though I've been a decade in SQL DB Admin so table design won't be a headache (much!).

Got a meeting tomorrow with a fellow who runs a small family-staffed wholesalers, pretty much a blank sheet site, processes about 2,000 orders a year with data strewn everywhere across umpteen Excel files and Sage. We met last week and wants me to have a database put together containing all product ranges, button-touch remote reporting on profits/sales etc, warehouse stock levels, billing, etc, none of which are currently automated/interconnected.

I'm thinking that it's not going to be much more complex than Northwind, but as this is my first foray into 1-1 consultancy and proj-managing the entire SDLC, I wanted to get some idea of what questions I'll need to ask, what kind of timelines I should quote for R+D.

Anyway, I think an Access db should suffice for the above purposes, again not dissimilar in structure to Northwind, but with more forms/reports for the accounts side.

My questions are;

1) Anyone have a general checklist/roadmap?

2) What kind of timelines I should be quoting? (assuming uninterrupted work, free access to all data etc, I estimate completion in a couple of months, more if he bothers me with extra work, in/out of project.)

3) What kind of questions should I be asking him at our meeting?

4) He feels he'd benefit from BI as do most businesses, but what kinds of benefits should be agreed here for a small firm like his?

5) He wants to replace Sage for his accts, so far he's just using it for billing/P+L reporting, but I imagine his reporting needs will grow. Anyone common 'Gotcha's when it comes to migrating from Sage to MSA ?

6) Could I use a stock template from within Access and build outwards from there?

Thanks in advance, everyone!!


Jaybee

 

[spikepl]

Here are some of the very first questions I'd ask if I got an inquiry of this nature (knowing nothing about the business in question other than what you wrote here):

1. What are the reasons for bespoke development, instead of using commercial verified and tested off-the-shelf software? The reason for this question is that dedicated development and testing are quite expensive.
2. Where will the business be 1,2 or 3 years from now? The outside world is not static, and you see more and more supply-chain integration, so what will the customers want and what can the suppliers offer, now and in the future? Web-access? Integration with their catalogues and/or ERP/MRP-systems? The reason here is that you can spend a lot of effort on automating what you have, while the outside world moves on, so a sensible target may be defined by the state of the world 1-2-3 years from now, and not as-is today.

 

[gemma-the-husky]

what does he think he will be paying for this?

what do you think it is likely to cost? are you giving him a fixed price?


i suspect one of you will not like the answer. This reads like a big big job.

 

[JaybeeTheBeefy]

Spike:

1) Don't know. He simply mentioned that he finds Sage "annoyingly unco-operative" at pulling the kind of data out that he wants. Which is fine, I can write a custom sproc for whatever querying requirement he has, but the rest I'll have to ask him;

2) He wants to expand the business dynamically, it's very young and foresees and eightfold increase 5 years. I'm thinking it may be better to have an Access f/end that handles about 10 concurrent connections for now, a SQL Server xpress back end, that should take care of requirement for a couple of years. If his growth plans meet target then he won't be worried about spending a few grand upgrading front+back ends.

Gemma - I'll be an employee, he's already spending quite large sums on web work that he wants to inhouse so that'll be my first remit, closely followed by the project above. I think it'll cost him a couple of months of my salary, that's after the web work, and also assuming he doesn't throw more concurrent work my way (and I've told him already that would slow down the process)

My question is whether a couple of months, given my experience, would be enough to get a working protype ready for testing - I think it is.

 

[gemma-the-husky]

good luck

i doubt if a couple of months is adequate for the whole shebang, though, although your experience will clearly help. depends how much time you think you need to spend on analyis before you start development.

If you are an employee it's easier - you can start gradually and build up.

the thing is ... if you/he finds Sage awkward to use despite the millions they have spent on it - it ought to give some insight into just how difficult it all is.

 

[JaybeeTheBeefy]

good luck

i doubt if a couple of months is adequate for the whole shebang, though, although your experience will clearly help. depends how much time you think you need to spend on analyis before you start development.

I intend to give analysis/requirement gathering every chance, and will champion it to the hilt. Start to finish, how long do you think would be adequate, in your judgment?

the thing is ... if you/he finds Sage awkward to use despite the millions they have spent on it - it ought to give some insight into just how difficult it all is.

True, but I do hear/read a lot that Sage is a pain in the sphincter to drag meaningful data out of. Might be easier to ODBC into the tables and run SQL queries from Mgt Studio.

 

[spikepl]

I agree with Dave - this is not a small project. And I would first of all sort out the business justification for all this, because so far it seems rather unclear. A more usual starting point for this sort of project would be a business case, rather than setting out with discussing solutions.

Look into some agile methods /staged development, especially in this instance, where the stakeholders sit next door (and stakeholders get ideas incessantly).

ODBC into tables and run Mgtmt Studio? To be honest this is an avoidable risk and therefore not a good permantent business solution. What happens if you get hit by a bus? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bus_factor

As to duration? There is not enought info here to give any sensible estimate, but 2 months for a de facto ERP-system seems to me very low.

Once you have some requirements, you could make a product breakdown structure, estimate the relative size of each "leaf" in points, estimate the effort to produce one working and tested and verified point and add it all up. Once you get going , you can measure your speed and adjust the delivery schedule accordingly.

 

[JaybeeTheBeefy]

I agree with Dave - this is not a small project. And I would first of all sort out the business justification for all this, because so far it seems rather unclear. A more usual starting point for this sort of project would be a business case, rather than setting out with discussing solutions.

Look into some agile methods /staged development, especially in this instance, where the stakeholders sit next door (and stakeholders get ideas incessantly).

ODBC into tables and run Mgtmt Studio? To be honest this is an avoidable risk and therefore not a good permantent business solution. What happens if you get hit by a bus?

It's a small company, you can count the staff on the fingers of one hand, plus the odd part-timer, so the stakeholders are pretty much all around the campfire.

I agree his objectives are quite vague, he either would rather not commit them to writing, or the entire meetings may just be his devious way of obtaining free consultancy. No way to know.

He claims he's being hindered by the setup, so tomorrow I'll compile a list of what he wants to achieve (he mentioned reducing staff spending time inefficiently and getting better BI on his web analytics), but I suspect I won't know precisely what gains he wishes to make until I'm actually part of the business.

And I'll be driving there/back. (grins maniacally!)

 

[gemma-the-husky]

i've just picked this up again. The size of the company is part of the problem. THe requirements are often no less for a small company compared with a large company - but the avaialble resources and expectations are very different.

A large company might happily pay £20000 or more (just a figure out of the air) to get a bespoke devlopment that gives them what they want. A small company will need virtually the same thing, but may well not have those sort of resources.

That's why we make compromises. eg I would not try and develop a SL/PL/NL for sale(Accounts receivable, payable, General Ledger for our American friends). There are lots of useable alternatives already out there.

I have built a NL/GL, but I actually give it away.