How to make a large project?

[KitaYama]

if other answer to the question

All experts are getting nervous here, but I'm really enjoying it.
Maybe because I'm not an expert and don't mind reading repeated solutions over and over.

 

[CJ_London]

The counting ("..you've got between 10 and 42 months..") needs to be redone

I would like to thing you are capable of doing that yourself

Form with moduless are actually 634
Report with modules are actually 299
Modules of code are actually 109

Already now they do not appear to be those described in the Microsoft documentation

provide the source for your figures

 

[amorosik]

I would like to thing you are capable of doing that yourself

Yes sure, the sum is 1042, i can do it up to three figures

provide the source for your figures

Source is CJ_London

...
There is also a limit of 1000 modules - which includes forms with code - so if all your forms had code you would be limited to 1000 forms.
...

 

[The_Doc_Man]

For the purposes of solving the problem described it was not necessary to explain the specific case

Yes it was!!!!!!!!!

I've been telling you that we cannot be specific when dealing with pure abstraction. When dealing with abstraction, we can ONLY offer generalities. You keep on demanding specifics starting from vague generalities. More than one of us suggested various issues in a "divide and conquer" strategy but even that, which DEFINITELY applies here, wasn't to your liking.

OP is used to listen to other, if other answer to the question

WE GAVE YOU ANSWERS.

But because you dealt in abstractions, WE had to deal in abstractions. And you wanted specifics when we didn't have anything on which to base those specifics. THIS is the kind of situation that wastes our time when we have other people with actual problem descriptions. Your tactic was quite selfish and, forgive me for saying it this way, approached a certain degree of ignorance.

To explain what seems to be a harsh characterization, let me ask a question to illustrate the point, @amorosik ...

If you go to a doctor and say "I don't feel so good" - and that's ALL you say - do you think your doctor will immediately tell you how to combat your condition? Or will that doctor ask for specifics so as to narrow down the issue? If your doctor then says you have to stop smoking hashish, will you listen? Or will you complain to your friends at the hookah bar about your unreasonable doctor who won't answer your questions correctly?

Why is this situation any different? Do you not see that we feel like the doctor with an uncooperative and unresponsive patient? Can you expand your perception of this situation to consider OUR feelings on the subject?

We have obviously not abandoned you. You have gotten responses from multiple senior members well past 80 posts in a technical, single-question thread. Usually, it is the Watercooler that generates long-winded sequences threads in excess of 100 posts.

 

[Bennet]

Form with moduless are actually 634
Report with modules are actually 299
Modules of code are actually 109
The counting ("..you've got between 10 and 42 months..") needs to be redone

Amazing!

Are many of those forms automatically generated or has someone really created all of those manually??

Can I ask what sort of things they do? Are there lots of forms created just to get the user to answer a question or confirm something?

Sounds like a nightmare!

Still genuinely interested to understand how it's grown so much. And especially why you need to keep adding forms at a rate of dozens per month!

 

[CJ_London]

Please provide the link to where I said

Form with moduless are actually 634
Report with modules are actually 299
Modules of code are actually 109

 

[amorosik]

Please provide the link to where I said

Form with moduless are actually 634
Report with modules are actually 299
Modules of code are actually 109

Sorry but maybe I explained myself badly

I wrote this (the number of form/report/modules)

You wrote that there is a maximum limit of 1000 forms

After that I pointed out to you that the limit of 1000 forms is not real because in my case it was exceeded
This observation makes me think that the maximum limits of objects as described by Microsoft are not always valid
And should not be taken as absolute constraints

 

[amorosik]

Amazing!
Are many of those forms automatically generated

No

Can I ask what sort of things they do? Are there lots of forms created just to get the user to answer a question or confirm something?

Invoices, items, prices, the usual things

Still genuinely interested to understand how it's grown so much. And especially why you need to keep adding forms at a rate of dozens per month!

It grew like this because new features were added to an initial minimal core
And having to add more, now I'm trying to understand how to organize things a little better

 

[Minty]

Still genuinely interested to understand how it's grown so much. And especially why you need to keep adding forms at a rate of dozens per month!

@Bennet it hasn't.

This entire thread (You need to read all it, not just the last two pages), until you managed to get an answer from the OP, has been based on supposition and obscurity on the purpose and ultimately reasoning behind the question, whilst altering the question subtly when not getting an answer they wanted or when someone was asking specifics.

I actually doubt there is any answer that will satisfy the OP as he denies he asked a specific question, when clearly he did.
He apparently knows the limits he has asked about but still wants to know more.

Statements like this

For the purposes of solving the problem described it was not necessary to explain the specific case

are clearly written to try and demonstrate some form of superior intellect, when actually, all they are doing is reinforcing that he (the OP) has no real desire to comprehend the myriad of advice given or is simply too dim to understand it.

 

[Bennet]

now I'm trying to understand how to organize things a little better

It sounds a bit like there might be lots of highly bespoke forms for very specific purposes.

If that's the case, it should be possible to create forms that dynamically alter themselves that can be re-used for multiple purposes. If that's true you might be able to delete hundreds of them.

Hard to say without knowing more though.

 

[Minty]

No


Invoices, items, prices, the usual things


It grew like this because new features were added to an initial minimal core
And having to add more, now I'm trying to understand how to organize things a little better

If only you had written this to start with we would have known exactly what you wanted to find out.

 

[Minty]

If that's the case, it should be possible to create forms that dynamically alter themselves that can be re-used for multiple purposes. If that's true you might be able to delete hundreds of them.

You can only create a finite amount of objects on forms, including any that are deleted.

This is therefore not recommended under any circumstances, in addition you can't make design changes in a compiled ACCDE version of any Access application, so "on the Fly" changes are a no-no.

 

[amorosik]

are clearly written to try and demonstrate some form of superior intellect, when actually, all they are doing is reinforcing that he (the OP) has no real desire to comprehend the myriad of advice given or is simply too dim to understand it.

When a person asks for something, I don't think we can talk about 'superior intellect'
Otherwise this person wouldn't ask

 

[Bennet]

You can only create a finite amount of objects on forms, including any that are deleted.

This is therefore not recommended under any circumstances, in addition you can't make design changes in a compiled ACCDE version of any Access application, so "on the Fly" changes are a no-no.

Any time I want to show my user some data or pick something from a list I do it dynamically with a universal form. (Not created on the fly - it already exists - you just alter the text and the source query etc etc.)

Or maybe the OP is creating a new form for every new product line or something. That could obviously be reduced to one form.

299 reports sounds like it just needs some more dynamic query writing rather than a bespoke query for each.... whatever it is.

109 modules sounds a bit like he might have a new module for every procedure, or be duplicating code. Could probably be consolidated massively.

(Appreciate you know all this. OP may not! Or maybe he is a genius far beyond everyone else here. I'm sort of hoping that's what it turns out to be. )

 

[amorosik]

If only you had written this to start with we would have known exactly what you wanted to find out.

You can understand exactly what I wanted by reading post1

 

[Minty]

You can understand exactly what I wanted by reading post1

We did, very quickly afterwards you wrote in post #5:

The question is: how to organize a project to avoid it reaching dimensions incompatible with the limits of the development environment
All other considerations are useless

Read carefully the last line that YOU WROTE , dismissing any reference to any existing applications, experience, or what it was you were doing that would involve adding dozens of objects every month.

We asked, you diverted.
We asked again, you obfuscated.

We gave up.

 

[CJ_London]

Sorry but maybe I explained myself badly

All the time, all the time

So you have an app- after decompiling and compacting what is the file size? My guess is nothing like 2gb so likely that is not an issue

Withe regards forms/reports - how many actually have a module? Easy to see in the vba navigation window.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Did you inadvertently leave out a UAT environment when describing your process? - so the users have a chance to review/verify the functionality expected, implement and test urgent fixes and set up a change log and to get sign off from the users/project owner?

Fair question. Testing of that type was informal but the project's owner (my direct supervisor) had frequent check & sign-off opportunities. Some of my users agreed to look at things and DID provide feedback. But there was no fifth environment for user acceptance testing. Part of the issue was that we were feeding monthly or weekly reports and acceptance testing was ultimately dependent on whether our reports passed the requirements of our system security overseers. The interfaces for data updates DEFINITELY were user-tested and were passed through multiple stages until we got the first "real" system up. Once the production environment went live, testing of new features was a bit trickier.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Already now they do not appear to be those described in the Microsoft documentation

If you look around various sites regarding a limit on the number of records, the answer is that it depends on the number and size of fields as well as overhead issues - like how many other tables share the same file. The ultimate limit is that number of records that which, if exceeded, would cause the individual file to exceed 2 GB. Any combination of records that blows the container's limit is the actual limit. You want "busy" forms? You'll have room for fewer of them. You want "lean, sparse" forms? You can fit a lot more of those. You have to know how to read that documentation. The answer is quite clear. Access has limits. It doesn't matter which way you attempt to pass the limit, but if you pass that limit, you are done.

So... how many records can you have? I don't know because I can't see your schema.

Some limits are hard and solid, like the number of fields in a record or the maximum size of a single form in inches. Some are interdependent on the makeup of the thing testing that limit. You are going to have to live with "amorphous" limits.

 

[amorosik]

All the time, all the time
So you have an app- after decompiling and compacting what is the file size? My guess is nothing like 2gb so likely that is not an issue
Withe regards forms/reports - how many actually have a module? Easy to see in the vba navigation window.

My current specific application is of no importance
The important thing is how to make a project with a number of objects that exceeds the size of the objects contained in a single Access file