Thank you the Net 2.0 and Dairy Farmer, rethinking this particular database, Dairy Farmer, you have a good idea, removing it completly will be just fine. No one needs to use any of the options available in the tool bar, I already have all the buttons they need to use in the database forms. Thank you for that information, and the net 2.0, that too will work on some of my other databases where they can use the tool bar but being able to remove some options is great. Not all users will know about the shift key trick so I dont think that will be a concern. Thanks again for your ideas.