Are you an atheist? (2 Viewers)

[Dick7Access]

I want to know what I am from, ok I am sure that I have stolen the odd paper clip, exceeded the speed limit, but I have never knowingly hurt anybody,coveted their wife or ox, committed adultery etc, ok I'm a dull boring old fart but it would appear that my only "sin" is doubting a story that I cannot verify.

Brian

Doesn't seem fair does it. I have committed all the above, and more, and still saved.

 

[Dick7Access]

Oh, I keep hearing about this original sin, but why should I be punished for something I didn't do?


Brian

Better question?, why should I be set free from what I did do?

 

[Brianwarnock]

Better question?, why should I be set free from what I did do?

Not a better question, just a different one, but aren't you saved if you truly repent?

Brian

 

[Dick7Access]

Not a better question, just a different one, but aren't you saved if you truly repent?

Brian

What is the Bible definition of repent?

 

[Brianwarnock]

What is the Bible definition of repent?

Hey ! You tell me it's a long time since I read the bible or listened to any religious oratory.

Or are you telling me that you do not need to repent, whatever the definition, you will be saved so long as you profess to believe in Jesus?

Brian

 

[Dick7Access]

Hey ! You tell me it's a long time since I read the bible or listened to any religious oratory.

Or are you telling me that you do not need to repent, whatever the definition, you will be saved so long as you profess to believe in Jesus?

Brian

Bingo. The Bible definition of repent is not being sorry for your sins, that's the work's/world's definition. How could you be sorry for the original sin which you did not commit. How could you be sorry for a sin you did not even know it was a sin.
Bible definition is turning from anything else you are trusting for salvation, or turning from nothing for your salvation and turning to the redemptive work that Jesus the Christ did on the cross.

 

[ColinEssex]

I want to know what I am from, ok I am sure that I have stolen the odd paper clip, exceeded the speed limit, but I have never knowingly hurt anybody,coveted their wife or ox, committed adultery etc, ok I'm a dull boring old fart but it would appear that my only "sin" is doubting a story that I cannot verify.

Brian

Not good enough Brian, you will burn in hell and eternal damnation.

What you need to do is lie about being a Christian (except on Sundays). Be a gun wielding wannabe Wyatt Earp, take a gun to church, preach utter rubbish, be a hypocrite (very important).
Then you need to patronise people as if you are some higher being and they are scum.

Actually, you can see examples of all the above on these forums.

Col

 

[Galaxiom]

"The sins of the father will be visited upon the son". That's old school retribution.

Not just the son but the descendents to the third and fourth generation.

It is worse for women. God decreed that all women for all time would suffer increased pain in childbirth because of Eve's transgression.

The Abrahamic religions are indeed primitive and have absolutely nothing to offer modern civilisations, least of all, guidance on the subject of morality.

Their gods are sociopaths.

 

[Frothingslosh]

The Abrahamic religions are indeed primitive and have absolutely nothing to offer modern civilisations, least of all, guidance on the subject of morality.

It's just a shame that the vast majority of modern Christians are so caught up in their their Old Testament beliefs and "I believe in Jesus, so no matter how evil I am, I'm going to heaven" attitudes rather than paying more attention to what Jesus is said to have actually said (little things like the Golden Rule, the Sermon on the Mount, the Parable of the Adulterous Wife, things like that).

Gandhi nailed it when he was asked about Christians, I'm sad to say.

 

[Dick7Access]

So when Brian says
Your answer is what "Jesus loves you" "have faith"? The only way to get back to the original sin is through the Old Testament.

Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
Romans 5:12 (KJV)

 

[Rabbie]

It always puzzles me why so many Christians nowadays attach so much importance to the Old Testament when they ignore the OT laws about food. Jesus made it clear to me that he did not accept many of the OT rules but still the fundamentalists still cling to every other word in the OT despite what is said in the New Testament.

Just reading the last couple of pages makes me despair of the lack of knowledge of basic Christian knowledge by some of its defenders. Have they never read the parable of the Sheep and the Goats when Jesus makes it clear that there will be surprises over who gets into heaven and he makes it clear that people's actions are the most important things.

It seems if you read what he said properly then getting into Heaven is not just a matter of belief but of putting that belief into practice. Sorry all you Holy Joes, you may find that you have to account for actions before getting into Heaven if it exists, of course.

 

[Dick7Access]

It always puzzles me why so many Christians nowadays attach so much importance to the Old Testament when they ignore the OT laws about food. Jesus made it clear to me that he did not accept many of the OT rules but still the fundamentalists still cling to every other word in the OT despite what is said in the New Testament.

Just reading the last couple of pages makes me despair of the lack of knowledge of basic Christian knowledge by some of its defenders. Have they never read the parable of the Sheep and the Goats when Jesus makes it clear that there will be surprises over who gets into heaven and he makes it clear that people's actions are the most important things.

It seems if you read what he said properly then getting into Heaven is not just a matter of belief but of putting that belief into practice. Sorry all you Holy Joes, you may find that you have to account for actions before getting into Heaven if it exists, of course.

You are right concerning the OT. I for one, am not bound by the OT !!!

 

[Bladerunner]

It always puzzles me why so many Christians nowadays attach so much importance to the Old Testament when they ignore the OT laws about food. Jesus made it clear to me that he did not accept many of the OT rules but still the fundamentalists still cling to every other word in the OT despite what is said in the New Testament.

And there is several churches that dances with snakes?
The first five books of the old testament were written by God himself and given to Moses. Of course it contained Gods story of creation and Adam & Eve among others. The rest is a sorted history of the people and the parables that bring with them a sense of morality. And Yes Rabbie, there will many surprises when Christ returns for the last time.

Just reading the last couple of pages makes me despair of the lack of knowledge of basic Christian knowledge by some of its defenders. Have they never read the parable of the Sheep and the Goats when Jesus makes it clear that there will be surprises over who gets into heaven and he makes it clear that people's actions are the most important things.

Another parable is : 'the rich will find it easier to pass a camel through the eye of a needle than get into heaven.' Yes peoples actions are important but it means nothing if you have not accepted him as your savior.

It seems if you read what he said properly then getting into Heaven is not just a matter of belief but of putting that belief into practice. Sorry all you Holy Joes, you may find that you have to account for actions before getting into Heaven if it exists, of course.

There will be a lot of that !

 

[Frothingslosh]

So when Brian says
Your answer is what "Jesus loves you" "have faith"? The only way to get back to the original sin is through the Old Testament.

My answer is 'Original sin is nonsense created by the Catholic Church in the early Dark Ages in order to cement its hold on power.'

If you think oiginal sin is a thing, however, then you need look no further than Jesus' death on the cross, which, according to the NT, was, in part, to free humanity from said original sin. (Rom 5:12-5:21)

 

[Bladerunner]

My answer is 'Original sin is nonsense created by the Catholic Church in the early Dark Ages in order to cement its hold on power.'

If you think oiginal sin is a thing, however, then you need look no further than Jesus' death on the cross, which, according to the NT, was, in part, to free humanity from said original sin. (Rom 5:12-5:21)

Doggonit even though you have pure evil under your name, you are pretty perceptive. The original sin (Genesis 2:7 thru 3:4) was again in the first 5 chapters. You talk about the churches power. Yet, the Egyptians held the Isralites for 400 years in bondage (slavery). What about Genghis Khan and all the other dictators throughout the ages. I guess they were ok because there was no religion??????????
involved. what about the Islam religion. The Arabs were not exactly friendly to anyone outside their circles. I think you and some others on this thread need to get a new whipping boy!.

 

[Brianwarnock]

?..You talk about the churches power. Yet, the Egyptians held the Isralites for 400 years in bondage (slavery). What about Genghis Khan and all the other dictators throughout the ages. I guess they were ok because there was no religion??????????
involved. what about the Islam religion. The Arabs were not exactly friendly to anyone outside their circles. I think you and some others on this thread need to get a new whipping boy!.

Surely your memory is not that poor that you don't remember Asis getting attacked when he tried to convert us all to Islam , the reason that the Christian religion appears to be the only one facing criticism is that it is the one being defended, quite rightly by those who accept it.
Another point is that one person's evil does not excuse another's.

Brian

 

[Frothingslosh]

Doggonit even though you have pure evil under your name, you are pretty perceptive. The original sin (Genesis 2:7 thru 3:4) was again in the first 5 chapters. You talk about the churches power. Yet, the Egyptians held the Isralites for 400 years in bondage (slavery). What about Genghis Khan and all the other dictators throughout the ages. I guess they were ok because there was no religion??????????
involved. what about the Islam religion. The Arabs were not exactly friendly to anyone outside their circles. I think you and some others on this thread need to get a new whipping boy!.

Glad you like the title. I took it after being accused (in another thread on this very forum) of being a traitor because I favor background checks for weapon purchases, giving women control of their own bodies, and not punishing gay people for the crime of being born. (Edit: Oh, and for stating that it was idiotic to choose to die rather than let a mugger have your wallet.)

I'm not sure what bringing Islam (which doesn't accept the doctrine of original sin) into the discussion has to do with anything other than showing your credentials as yet another Islamaphobe. But to balance, we have the Inquisition burning to death anyone who didn't profess precisely what the Catholic church espoused (along with anyone whose possessions various clergy and nobles desired), the Holocaust, the Kill the Gays bill, many, many assaults on Jerusalem in the Crusades, the Yugoslavian Civil War, the Vatican spreading rumors in Africa that condoms cause AIDS, and the list of atrocities by Christians goes on.

In the real world, the refusal of the idiotic "Sin was impossible until Eve sinned" doctrine (a wonderful example of circular logic) means that responsibility for your own actions rests on YOU, not some mythological ancient ancestor. That doesn't make things like anything listed above 'ok' - it means that the evil men and women choose to do is their own damn fault. It means you need to take responsibility for your own choices, not say 'but a vile, disgusting, evil woman thousands of years ago MADE me do bad things!'

It's really not a difficult concept.

Edit:

You know, I was thinking about this discussion while waiting for a report to run, and I'm curious. Just how precisely did you take 'I don't believe the entire human race is damned by default because Eve ate an apple' and get from it 'Obviously I think that because we're not doomed by Eve's choice of knowledge over ignorance, it follows that every act, no matter how evil, vile, or malicious, is perfectly acceptable.'? In other circles, that's what one might call Insane Troll Logic.

 

[alamnizamani]

Please read Holly Quran message from our creator God through Muhammad Peace be upon him. I have some questions that can you see air, voice, signals, electricity and etc but you believe in these things. If you want to see Allah (God) see the world, see inner of your body. When you die you will see what is reality. Thanks

 

[Bladerunner]

Have tried to post a "Quote" but when I hit the submit button, it tells me I did not have enough characters or words????????????????????????????????????????????????


Later I guess.

 

[Galaxiom]

The quote does not count in the post length. It expects you to be adding something of your own.

However the requirement is not especially long.