After programming Access VBA for a number of years (split database with mixture of runtime and non runtime and used for several years successfully by 2 manufacturing companies I worked for) I think it's time to say goodbye. There's no native Treeview control, accdb files don't open on 64bit, you get annoying security messages popping up which forces you to edit the registry or go down some other laborious route and the ribbon is just plain annoying. It could have been great but now it's just shaky and confusing. I don't have time to get to MVP standard and, quite frankly, I shouldn't have to. It's ok for knocking up ideas but as for implementing them in the real world with various versions of windows and office then proceed at your peril. Time to move over to HTML5 and sqlserver Express (although I'll still use Access as a Lego set)
Goodbye Access (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter zooropa67
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Those 2 technologies alone won't do it. One's a database, one's a markup syntax. You need a scripting language (PHP, VB, Perl, C#) between them to make them work together. Don't even get me started on CSS and how each browser implements it and HTML5 differently.
But no the grass over there is definitely greener.
Yes, I know that and I'll be using PHP. Don't care too much about Browser differences as I'm developing for a specific niche that will use Chrome. Funny how the 2 replies I got said nothing about the deficiencies of Access. Anyone free to pitch in as it would be good to have a discussion about it. I like 99% of Access but it's the 1% that drives me up the wall and it's not because I'm lacking in experience.
stopher
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Maybe because it's been discussed many times already?
For 64bit are you saying you can't run Access on a 64bit computer?
For treeview, I see you are using Treeview in Access albeit from Windows common controls. Is this really a problem? I've run Treeview for years without issue.
Sure all development tools have their pros and cons. I don't like the fact that there's no datagrid view in Access. But the 99% it does do well would be a lot more effort for me in other development environments. That said I would like to venture more into other environments.
Isskint
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I like 99% of chocolate but its the weight gain that drives me up the wall:banghead:...I still eat it though, yummmmmmmm
zooropa67 I would suggest that giving up something for a few irritations is rash. Yes there are issues that the Access community has long argued and complained about, but (IMHO) the strength of MS Access is the ability for an untrained person to design something reasonable. When you get to the point of needing to role out a DB across multiple platforms OR need that more complete package, then perhaps it is time to use a different tool or even get the professionals involved.
I have regularly encountered the problems you describe but through the assistance of this forum and some helpful people in company IT departments, I have overcome them.
I generally find the time to move is driven by my bosses lack of vision, foresight and frustration which manifests itself in the helpful/untrained employee getting disillusioned.
It is your choice and i wish you well... but remember, there are people here that will move mountains to assist you.
Ok, I'll Bite....I'm with you on this one, but for me, I haven't found anything else that would be greener.
Truth is, that programming is only 10% of my job. For me to change to anything else would require a lot of nights trying to become proficient in another language/platform. I'm not willing to do that unless the difference is substantial.
I've looked into Visual Studio (with VB.net), but they don't have any kind of reporting (at least the community version when I was looking).
What other options are there? I would be interested in another RAD type of software, but I don't need to develop enterprise level solutions. My go to at this point has been Access 2010/2013 as a front end, with MS SQL Express as a back end.
Truth is, that programming is only 10% of my job. For me to change to anything else would require a lot of nights trying to become proficient in another language/platform. I'm not willing to do that unless the difference is substantial.
I've looked into Visual Studio (with VB.net), but they don't have any kind of reporting (at least the community version when I was looking).
What other options are there? I would be interested in another RAD type of software, but I don't need to develop enterprise level solutions. My go to at this point has been Access 2010/2013 as a front end, with MS SQL Express as a back end.
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This is not an attempt to get you to change your mind. I am actually commiserating with you and sharing a related experience.
I felt exactly the way you did a long time ago - for the Borland product. When Paradox for DOS was out there, it was the best thing going. Then Windows happened. (For parallels, think of the similar implications from the Forrest Gump movie...). When Windows happened, Paradox for Windows came out and Access was its competitor. I had both products in-house for a while before I finally gave up. My conclusion so many years ago was that Paradox for Windows had (as we say in the Deep South...) screwed the pooch whereas Access correctly knew to "get out of the way" of the folks who wanted to go techie with it.
I know that Access is a pain in the patootie for a lot of things, and I wish it did more in some fields such as security. But I've seen too many products that claim to be the best thing since sliced bread as database products. Most of them don't even have a horse in the race. More like a donkey, except that the comparison is unfair to donkeys.
Seriously, if you feel that Access is wrong for you, by all means go for something else. Just understand that some of us have learned to make Access good enough via various precautionary measures that it gets the job done.
I'll draw an analogy from the real world. I'm an organist. Worked my way through college via a different kind of keyboard than one with letters and numbers on it. I had an instrument at home and it was time to upgrade. I had two choices, which I will name as "L" and "T" (don't want to offend the manufacturers here). The "L" was the epitome of musical automation. Joe Schmuckadelli could play it and have it sound OK. The "T" was not so heavily automated. You actually needed to know something to make it sound good.
The problem was that if you were capable of playing the keyboard by music and formal training rather than by ear, you had to turn off 30%+ of the "L" instrument to get that automation out of the way. When you did, fully HALF of the sounds on the accompaniment keyboard (which formal organists call the "Great Manual") were unavailable. On the "T" you had less automation and had to do a bit more, but you never had to give up the majority of the instrument to do anything.
I find your comments akin to the way I felt, because my mother had owned two "L" organs herself, then I bought one for myself. We had always had an "L" in the house. A lightning strike to my main power line fried my "L" and forced my hand. When I made the comparison, the "T" did more even though the "L" had more bells and whistles. Access forces you to do more because the automation is not the strongest you've ever seen, but their competitors don't give you the ability to do anything else.
So just remember, you can get the database tools to do a lot for you - but what if they don't do the right thing? Sure, Access wizards are as dumb as a box of rocks - but they offer GREAT starting points for implementing event code as well as simple reports and forms. You just have to go back and customize their outputs a little. The other man's grass is always greener - at least until he rolls the joint and smokes it.
I felt exactly the way you did a long time ago - for the Borland product. When Paradox for DOS was out there, it was the best thing going. Then Windows happened. (For parallels, think of the similar implications from the Forrest Gump movie...). When Windows happened, Paradox for Windows came out and Access was its competitor. I had both products in-house for a while before I finally gave up. My conclusion so many years ago was that Paradox for Windows had (as we say in the Deep South...) screwed the pooch whereas Access correctly knew to "get out of the way" of the folks who wanted to go techie with it.
I know that Access is a pain in the patootie for a lot of things, and I wish it did more in some fields such as security. But I've seen too many products that claim to be the best thing since sliced bread as database products. Most of them don't even have a horse in the race. More like a donkey, except that the comparison is unfair to donkeys.
Seriously, if you feel that Access is wrong for you, by all means go for something else. Just understand that some of us have learned to make Access good enough via various precautionary measures that it gets the job done.
I'll draw an analogy from the real world. I'm an organist. Worked my way through college via a different kind of keyboard than one with letters and numbers on it. I had an instrument at home and it was time to upgrade. I had two choices, which I will name as "L" and "T" (don't want to offend the manufacturers here). The "L" was the epitome of musical automation. Joe Schmuckadelli could play it and have it sound OK. The "T" was not so heavily automated. You actually needed to know something to make it sound good.
The problem was that if you were capable of playing the keyboard by music and formal training rather than by ear, you had to turn off 30%+ of the "L" instrument to get that automation out of the way. When you did, fully HALF of the sounds on the accompaniment keyboard (which formal organists call the "Great Manual") were unavailable. On the "T" you had less automation and had to do a bit more, but you never had to give up the majority of the instrument to do anything.
I find your comments akin to the way I felt, because my mother had owned two "L" organs herself, then I bought one for myself. We had always had an "L" in the house. A lightning strike to my main power line fried my "L" and forced my hand. When I made the comparison, the "T" did more even though the "L" had more bells and whistles. Access forces you to do more because the automation is not the strongest you've ever seen, but their competitors don't give you the ability to do anything else.
So just remember, you can get the database tools to do a lot for you - but what if they don't do the right thing? Sure, Access wizards are as dumb as a box of rocks - but they offer GREAT starting points for implementing event code as well as simple reports and forms. You just have to go back and customize their outputs a little. The other man's grass is always greener - at least until he rolls the joint and smokes it.
Thanks for all your replies. Much appreciated. You've convinced me that the pros of Access far outweighs the cons wrt to switching to a completely different platform (I'm somewhat competent in PHP and MySQL, CSS3). I was just looking for a bit of debate and some opinions. Hello, not goodbye Acess
