Greece Default - is it the End of The World as We Know It?

[Rx_]

Is the Greece Default going to trigger the end of the financial system? Trigger World War 3? Or, just cause a shortage of olives for the drinks in New York City's financial district?

It was suppose to be a surprise todeay that Greece didn't agree to some EU terms... again. The banks closed. ATM only dispurse about $60 USD a day in funds.

Putin offered aid. The US military NATO spokesman called that "agression".
The US moved over 5,000 troops and heavy arms (including tanks) into Russia's buffer zone. This violates the Minsk 2 agreement and has put the world on a nucular alert not seen since the Cold War. The troops in Russia's buffer zone is a first ever.

Russia has offered Greek to leave the EU and default and join Russia that is now alighed with China for trade. Some say Italy and Spain would follow suit.

Others say Greece is so small, the EU can just tax England and a few other EU countries that are doing better than other EU countries and pay the small debt off.

Meanwile two South American countries announced they can't make debt payments either. Maybe they hoped with the news on Greece, nobody will notice.

In the USA, probably where the problem began, 7 of 10 Americans can't point out the mid-East on a map. Greece is even worse. Yet, it is a headline news about the Russia threat and Greece banks closing. None of us know what they are driving at. Anyway, its suppose to be good for the USA as is any news nowdays.

World War One started with a small bank default when some Duke who owed money died. Banks were in bad shape back then. There is reason to think history tends to somewhat repeat itself.

Perhaps Germany will go Occupy Greece, but nowdays we just call it a "Collection Service"?

 

[MarkK]

The media OVER-HYPES BAD NEWS. Did you see that CNN piece on the ISIS parody flag at the pride parade in London?

Is it the end of the world? Nah, it's "just a bunch of dildos."

 

[Steve R.]

The problem is that rulers of a nation like to spend other peoples money to dispense freebies. The recipients of those freebies don't seem seem to comprehend that they will eventually have to pay the "credit card" back in the form of higher taxes and a reduction in services (austerity).

Markets fall as twin defaults loom in Greece, Puerto Rico

The US may eventually join Greece and Puerto Rico in becoming bankrupt.

 

[scott-atkinson]

I've already stockpiled Hummus in case there is a run on it...

 

[Steve R.]

I've already stockpiled Hummus in case there is a run on it...

Might be a premature action. Greece may need to dump Hummus on the open market at a lower price to raise money towards paying their debt.

 

[Brianwarnock]

.World War One started with a small bank default when some Duke who owed money died. Banks were in bad shape back then. There is reason to think history tends to somewhat repeat itself. .

An oversimplification of the situation In Europe at the time, don't confuse the excuse with the reason.

Brian

 

[Brianwarnock]

Most, if not all , of the developed countries appear to be in debt, what I want to know is who has got the dosh?

Brian

 

[scott-atkinson]

Most, if not all , of the developed countries appear to be in debt, what I want to know is who has got the dosh?

Brian

The 1% of the worlds population who are now richer than the remaining 99% combined...

Me thinks a revolution is coming...

 

[Rx_]

The problem is that rulers of a nation like to spend other peoples money to dispense freebies. The recipients of those freebies don't seem seem to comprehend that they will eventually have to pay the "credit card" back in the form of higher taxes and a reduction in services (austerity).

In the US we had the City of Detroit. Each election promised city union workers more and more. The offical government Actuary in report after report including the week after the bills couldn't be paid claimed the retirement fund was 99%. The judge wouldn't let any Civil Servant take out the cash because the actuaries swore it was 99% funded.
Of course later, the civil servants got 14 cents on the dollar. (14%).
Now, the State of Illonoise (Chicago) is in the same situation.
DONT PANIC - not one actuatury or banker went to jail or lost one penny of commission. The order of importance was maintained.

An American Territory (Purto Ricco) is somewhat like Greece in the EU.
A US bankruptcy judge has ruled that the pension fund of a small U.S. territory is a "governmental unit" and therefore not eligible to file Chapter 11.

At a State Civil Servant Retirement Fund convention, it is estimated that perhaps 70% are not actually solvant for the next 10 years. That is only about 1% of the US population or 7% of the working population.

The US Debt to GDP is not totally unlike Greece.

Now if the US fails, everyone better stock up on.... Bond salesmen?

 

[Steve R.]

Now if the US fails, everyone better stock up on.... Bond salesmen?

Those who possess bonds will be taking a significant haircut (losses).

Bonds are also a ticking time-bomb since interest rates are artificially low. When normal market driven interest rates come back (if ever) bonds will take a significant adverse hit (as in losses). Furthermore, the stock market is also inflated as bonds and savings accounts are crappy alternatives so they are dumping their un-invested cash there.

The credit crisis is caused by the lack of austerity. The public manta is
spend now and charge it to a "credit card". The politicians despite all their rhetoric refuse to make the tough decisions regarding balanced budgets. In the US that applies to both the Democrats and Republicans.

 

[Rx_]

Greece did what most Western countries have done and are still doing.

Most things that are "real" have a chance to drop as they are at Peak value due to the artifical low interest rates. Interest rates mean paper money (or debt) is being printed faster and faster to inflate the budget. US Housing is a Huge Bubble now.
This results in a endless bidding war. Housing goes up, car sales go up, ...
Seeking Alpha showed that 40% of new cars are now financed at 7 years, even with this low interest rate. What is a car worth in 5 years? Huge numbers of homes are now financed with 4% to 6% down. Everyone is qualified.
Printing money for cheap loans leads to mis-allocation of resources.
Like a newbie Programmer that makes all variables Public.

Today Oil dropped 4.25% because the majority of eneregy goes to manufacturing and production. The electrical use and other energy is dropping each quarter as jobs go away as the economy slows down. Cheap money makes uncertain markets.

War is the Health of the State - George Orwell
He should have said, War and Debt

 

[Steve R.]

Greece did what most Western countries have done and are still doing.

Several US states are in the same bind as is Puerto Rico. Student loans are a potential bubble that may soon burst.

War is the Health of the State - George Orwell
He should have said, War and Debt

As time progress the US is becoming evermore Orwellian. Not only that, but the US is also committing cultural suicide. For those not in-tune with the light of progressive left mantra it is instant vilification and ostrafication.

 

[Rx_]

The corporate News (NBC, CBS, ABC, Bloomberg ...) claimed the Greek vote was "too close to call". The Greek news shows a 2/3 against paying.
Civil Servants can't get access to thier money was another article today.

My sister learned to speak Greek just to make a couple of trips each year for the last decade. She had to stop the last year and half out of safety concerns.

The Bloomberg TV guest were all talking about what the EU did for Greece.
I have to look at Iceland in the situation. They dropped out of the system. Then, they actually jailed bankers for misleading bond sales. They also successfully sued JP Morgan and got a settlement in the Europe courts.
They don't really have a currency, they basically use the Canadian one for trade.
Bottom line, from unemployment and economic standing they are way ahead at this point.

While it is very difficult to make a "one size fits all" analysis, one observer said the EU has spent as much for the salaries of bankers in suits to meet and negotiate as the Greece debt. Yet, all of those unelected financial advisors still don't have an idea for a workable solution.

The US 4th of July and the Greece vote might have more in common than we suspect. Time will be the real judge.

 

[Rx_]

Reuters 20 minutes ago:
Greeks voted overwhelmingly on Sunday to reject terms of a bailout, risking financial ruin in a show of defiance that could splinter Europe.
With nearly half of the votes counted, official figures showed 61 percent of Greeks rejecting the bailout offer. An official interior ministry projection confirmed the figure as close to the expected final tally.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...re-is-a-No-vote-in-the-Greece-referendum.html
Telegraph claims "end of the world". Who ever wrote this article should have looked at Iceland. The writer paints a "end of the world" but is wrong on most points.

The US (NATO) has moved tens of thousands of troops to the Russia border. Germany deployed new troops on July 5. The Nuclear alert between the US / Russia is now at the same level as during the 1960s. The US NATO military has warned Russia not to offer Greece financial support as termed it as "aggression".

Well, this could grow into some huge mega accident fairly quickly.

 

[Brianwarnock]

I was in a jewellers in Crete in 2001 buying a necklace for my wife. The jeweller said that joining the euro would destroy Greece, but he was only a business man what did he know compared to the politicians.

Brian

 

[Rx_]

Greece Fallout: Italy and Spain Funded a Massive Backdoor Bailout of French Banks
Due to ties with the IMF, France would have been forced into a massive bailout of its banking system. So France was allowed to ... sell bonds backed by the rest of us citizens.
Article on The Council on Foreign Relations website last Thursday discussed some of the details.

DONT PANIC The bonds are being used to cover things like EU Civil Servant retirement funds. The Bondsalesmen got full comission to claim these funds are highly rated. Don't worry, all bankers are paid in full. That is all that really matters.

Some say the IMF is just a taxpayer subsidy for covering banks risk but all of the profits and fees can be kept by the banks. A bank cartel is just like an Oil or any other cartel. It looks out for the welfare of that group.

 

[AnthonyGerrard]

I was in a jewellers in Crete in 2001 buying a necklace for my wife. The jeweller said that joining the euro would destroy Greece, but he was only a business man what did he know compared to the politicians.

Brian

That's a long way to go for a necklace.

 

[Brianwarnock]

That's a long way to go for a necklace.

She was worth it.

Brian

 

[Rx_]

7/20/2015 - Good thing you bought that necklace then.
Today the Greece Sales Tax increased 10% now something like 25%
Just wondering how that is going to work out?

Many, many decades ago, a friend from college brought his dad from a south america country to buy CB Radios from me. They were the new communication technology, kind of like cell phones today. In today's money, they cost around $800 each. Kind of like a smart phone cost that much?
He told me that the import tax at customs for electronics was over 600%. The sales tax for me back then had just gone up to 2.75% and that was horrible.

There is an old Woody Alen book Without Feathers, full of very funny short stories.
He describes a mythical south american country revolution. They were so poor the country's biggest export was tarantula and VD.
Later the US had a cargo plane full of military going there. One guy asked where they were going, "somplace called xxx somewhere in south america for the revlution". "Sir, are we for or aginst the ruling dictatorship?" "Washington isn't sure yet, so half of us will fight for, the other half against".

I think that sums up the current events from this side of the Pond.

 

[Steve R.]

There is an old Woody Alen book Without Feathers, full of very funny short stories.
He describes a mythical south american country revolution. They were so poor the country's biggest export was tarantula and VD.
Later the US had a cargo plane full of military going there. One guy asked where they were going, "somplace called xxx somewhere in south america for the revlution". "Sir, are we for or aginst the ruling dictatorship?" "Washington isn't sure yet, so half of us will fight for, the other half against".

That seems to be a good summary concerning the US involvement in the Middle East. "Support" both warring sides.