The Virus that came from China. (1 Viewer)

Micron

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He was visiting a hospital. I guess it was either wear one, or give the impression that he really doesn't care about the health and safety of anyone who works there or is a patient. Certainly not something you want to portray this close to an election.
 

Steve R.

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Really? Unbelievable.
Did he apologized to those who believed him and didn’t wear a mask and got infected or lost their lives?
OK. Then what about the governor of New York, Andrew Cuomo a Democrat, sending those infected with Covid 19 back into nursing homes where they spread the disease. Next several Democratic governors, said it is OK to go out and protest, yet will have you arrested for trying to keep your business open.

Recently, the Mayor of New York City, another Democrat stopped contact tracing for Covid-19. So it will be impossible to determine who and who is not infected and who may be spreading the disease.
You may not like Trump, but the Democrats are openly obstructing the ability of government to manage this disease. Trump is not the boogeyman here.
 
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deletedT

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You may not like Trump, but the Democrats are openly obstructing the ability of government to manage this disease. Trump is not the boogeyman here.
Yes, you‘re right. I don’t like President Trump. But no, you are wrong. I‘m neither democrat nor republicant and I don’t know all of those governors you named Above and I’m not sure if you’re right or wrong about the way you judged them.
I don’t care what they did or what they said. Because they don’t have any effect in my life. But The President of US is different. Any comment, any tweet he sends out, changes a lot of things around. When you choose an idiot to sit in the White House, it becomes the whole nations problem. But when you choose an idiot as a governor, it’s your problem, not anyone else out of US borders.

Steve_R, forgive my rudeness, but from what I see from your posts (and several other members) here, you deny to see the facts because of your political stand point. I may be wrong, but there’s a difference between right and wrong. No matter which side you belong to. Your President was wrong about mask (and a lot of other things) and you try to justify it because another Democrat or Governor behaved this or that. What do you want to prove here? You bring your president position down to the level of a governor? And compare him to a governor?
Or because a Democrat does something foolish, your president is allowed to do the same mistakes?

Edit:
I’m very eager to know why when anyone points to something wrong about President Trump, your answer always contains something about Democrats. Nobody says Democrats are any better. Why you can’t simply answer without criticizing Democrats. I simply said he was wrong about mask. It’s not a Democrat VS Republican thing. It’s about was he right or wrong.
 
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deletedT

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He was visiting a hospital. I guess it was either wear one, or give the impression that he really doesn't care about the health and safety of anyone who works there or is a patient. Certainly not something you want to portray this close to an election.
Once he went to a company manufacturing Masks. Though there were stickers everywhere saying it‘s a prohibited area and everyone has to use a mask, he didn’t used any (and all those who were with him)
 

Steve R.

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I don’t care what they did or what they said. Because they don’t have any effect in my life.
You may feel yourself insulated from events transpiring in the US, but here we feel the effects everyday. I would also ask you to consider a Biden administration. Biden, is a liar, plagiarist, panderer, has his own touchy feely issues with women, and acts like a Trump wannabe. In short Biden is an empty-suite. You may not like Trump, but a Biden administration could even have a worse effect on you.
I may be wrong, but there’s a difference between right and wrong. No matter which side you belong to. Your President was wrong about mask (and a lot of other things) and you try to justify it because another Democrat or Governor behaved this or that.
Yes there is a difference between right and wrong, but there is also a relative issue. Not wearing a mask is a lot different than sending infected people into a nursing home where they infect a lot more people, some of whom die. That is clearly more serious than not wearing a mask.
... from what I see from your posts (and several other members) here, you deny to see the facts because of your political stand point.
Wrong. I am not denying to see any facts. As I pointed out above, that there is an issue of relative importance. If Trump fails to wear a mask at one event, it pales in comparison to Democratic governors and mayors purposely allowing and in fact ecnouraging people to congregate for political reasons. This has the effect of accelerating the spread the virus. Trump is one person, the protestor are thousands of people.
 

Jon

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I think if we are talking mask issues, why not look at the WHO's position? They say you don't need them. Still. If you think Trump should be wearing a mask, but the WHO says you don't need them, are you agreeing with Trump that the WHO is wrong about Covid advice? Or do you want to ignore WHO advice and say they are wrong and therefore Trump is wrong in his decision not to wear a mask?

Trump has a virtually zero risk of transferring Covid to anyone else because he and his Whitehouse staff are tested daily. That is unlike the general population, so a completely different risk profile applies.
 
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Micron

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They say you don't need them.
Maybe not true?
June 8, 2020 -- The World Health Organization has changed its stance on wearing face masks during the COVID-19 pandemic.People over 60 and people with underlying medical conditions should wear a medical-grade mask when they’re in public and cannot socially distance, the WHO said. The general public should wear a three-layer fabric mask in those situations.
Verification on the WHO website seems difficult. That comes from webmd.
 

Jon

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Ok, lets parse that out. It seems that is from about a week ago. They changed their position. But only partially. My view is that everybody should wear masks when out, but lets leave that aside for a minute. Trump does sometimes wear a mask, so lets get that out there. Most of the time when he hasn't worn a mask was prior to the WHO changing its mind. The WHO advice is very specific - for those with medical conditions or over 60's "who cannot socially distance." Maybe the president can. Also, as I mentioned earlier, since he and his staff are tested daily, different rules should apply. Look at say Premier League footballers. They aren't socially distancing, but they too are tested daily. So there are exceptions to the rules.

As I mentioned in the previous post, Trump has virtually zero risk in passing on Covid, unlike the generally public who are not tested daily.

Personally, I think the WHO has a lot to answer for. They can't have it both ways. On the one hand, they want to keep the masks for the medical workers, but on the other hand, they were saying there is not enough evidence that they are effective. A complete contradiction. Sly words deliberately designed to deceive the public.

Just to add, I understand that the WHO has come under pressure from hundreds of scientists recently who were complaining to the WHO that there is much evidence to suggest that mask usage is effective in reducing Covid.
 

Isaac

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Steve_R, forgive my rudeness, but from what I see from your posts (and several other members) here, you deny to see the facts because of your political stand point. I may be wrong, but there’s a difference between right and wrong. No matter which side you belong to. Your President was wrong about mask (and a lot of other things) and you try to justify it because another Democrat or Governor behaved this or that. What do you want to prove here? You bring your president position down to the level of a governor? And compare him to a governor?
Or because a Democrat does something foolish, your president is allowed to do the same mistakes?
--------------------
Wrong. I am not denying to see any facts. As I pointed out above, that there is an issue of relative importance. If Trump fails to wear a mask at one event, it pales in comparison to Democratic governors and mayors purposely allowing and in fact ecnouraging people to congregate for political reasons. This has the effect of accelerating the spread the virus. Trump is one person, the protestor are thousands of people.

What I have observed and some thoughts concerning it:
There are those who feel that whenever Trump is accused of doing something wrong, his supporters (or similar) answer the charge by simply comparing it to "worse" things done by the other side. They feel this is an inadequate response to the charge.
Then there are those who feel that the general sense of "awareness" about wrongs done generally, always seems to be skewed toward finding wrongs done by Trump. They feel that this is a legitimate problem in and of itself.

I have concluded that both viewpoints have merit, and unfortunately sometimes the interplay between them, when applied in actual situations, does cause some conflict, or the appearance thereof.

Several years ago, I was involved in an email conversation with the rest of my family. (Generally they are Republicans). I was bemoaning certain behaviors of ICE or Border Patrol, and the fact that Trump supported it. I can't remember what it was specifically, but at the time, it seemed very much on the side of immoral and overly mean. Something about separating families I think. Anyway, one of my brothers responded by telling me that "Well, take most OTHER countries - Mexico included. If you illegally enter their country, like they are ours, they do much worse to you than we are to them". To me that was the equivalent of, "Well, it's OK for us to do something immoral, because someone else does something similar and we are less bad than them". I told my family member that I thought his response to the charge was inappropriate or inadequate and perhaps a bit deflective.

However, there are many in this country who perceive that due to our media (mostly), there in imbalance in the awareness/sensitivity to wrongs committed only on one particular side of the political aisle. That too many people save all of their righteous indignation energy for one side.
Say you had a bunch of children on a playground. They were mostly split into two "groups", each group had a unique viewpoint and way of playing. Each group committed a share of rule infractions, deceit, bullying, etc. However, the playground referee mostly focused on one of these groups-Group 1. Group 1's flaws were magnified above all else and Group 2's flaws largely ignored.
EVEN THOUGH this difference in focus "shouldn't" be a defense (by Group 1) when charges on individual instances of bad behavior were brought up....Yet, it would be naive and maybe even disingenuous to have the expectation that Group 1 would continue patiently and humbly responding to each charge solely on the merits of that charge. Eventually, this would become untenable to even those on the highest of moral grounds; they would struggle with the overall approach to enforcement.

Again, I believe that both viewpoints have some merit. On the one hand, when Republicans are challenged about the right- or wrong-ness of a given policy, we should strive to respond on the merits of that issue alone - along with, perhaps, any comparisons that are useful in shedding a contextual light - but only with an eye toward identifying the right or wrongness of the thing (not merely as a "but he didn't get punished for that").

On the other hand, to the degree that my Playground analogy is actually true, we should not have the expectation that this will not factor into people's feelings about right, wrong, and enforcement. If it has risen to the level that some think it has, it can be expected to color the issue significantly. Fair enforcement and fair focus on all parties' wrongs is a very reasonable request.

Ironically, even within the current discussions on race equality vs. "crime & punishment", this issue can be clearly seen! There are those who argue that african americans are unequally targeted for harsher consequences in sentencing and bail. Most of us agree that, IF this is true, it seems patently wrong. If a white man and a black man have both committed the exact same crime, most of us would not want their punishment to be different, given that all else were equal. And IF such a "same punishment" result is NOT happening, then most people would hardly expect the african american to be silent on that issue, and merely admit "well, I did the crime - now I must do the time". Most fair people would expect this topic of unfair treatment to become inextricably involved in the conversation--and pratically inseparable from any discussion of the crime at hand.

I am not saying which one of these things I agree with, merely noting some observations about how I think they are interconnected and give rise to the feelings demonstrated in this very thread, and around the country.
 

Jon

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Lets take law and order. The Democrats turn a blind eye to mobs pulling down statues. But there are laws that say you cannot do that. The Republicans say it is terrible and shouldn't be done. Who is in the right? Some people may not want the statues to be there, but others do. The law is on the side of the Republicans. You cannot have a society where the public takes the law into their own hands. That is not democracy. Laws evolve over long periods of time to protect the interests of society. You cannot discard them in an instance because of a woke uprising.

Regarding, unequal punishment between people of different skin colour, I am sure both sides of the aisle agree that should not be the case. But a group may be vocal about an issue based on misinformation or perceived injustices that do not exist. We can take police brutality as one of them. I am still waiting for someone to show me the evidence that police brutality disproportionately affects blacks as opposed to whites. All I am getting is data that you would expect based on blacks being disproportionately involved in homicide and violent crime compared to whites. I say treat everybody fairly based on the crimes they commit. You have to look at race issues with neutrality, else you will let your biases affect your perceptions rather than just looking at what the data says.
 

deletedT

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Again, nobody is listening. You enjoy turning everything into a Democrat vs Republicans war.
My post was about President Trump not another party or governor.
President Trump was wrong about wearing mask and nobody is brave enough to admit it, or himself to apologize for it.
A lot of other countries' leaders asked their people to wear mask before W.H.O or any other organization had announced anything. Because they used their brain and they could think. Because they were concerned about the lives that depends on their decision.
And look at the them....For God's sake look at where they are in the list of deaths and infections.

Now you're blaming the other party or W.H.O. or relative whatever. The way I see it, President Trump was not brave enough to say: Sorry I was wrong. and his supporters are just blaming others.
 
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deletedT

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I was just curious and I had to ask it.
In our society, it's very common that our Prime Minister apologizes in public for something wrong he's done or said. Because we think accepting a wrong deed, prevents feature mistakes.

Has President Trump apologized for anything ever? Has he ever said : Sorry I was wrong.

I don't mean anything by this. I just want to find his character.

Edit: And please don't answer Democrats have never apologized too.
 
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AccessBlaster

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In our society, it's very common that our Prime Minister apologizes in public for something wrong he's done or said. Because we think accepting a wrong deed, prevents feature mistakes.
Has every Prime Minister apologized for every misdeeds? This is just a minor snapshot in time, some countries will fair better than others, but its just a snapshot.
 

Isaac

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Has every Prime Minister apologized for every misdeeds? This is just a minor snapshot in time, some countries will fair better than others, but its just a snapshot.
I was wondering about the same thing. Is Japan perfect? This sounds like heaven. If I go to Japan, have I died and gone to heaven?
 

deletedT

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You guys made me smile.
Forget my question. I didn't meant it to be us vs you. My apologies. I'm out of this conversation now.
 

The_Doc_Man

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@Tera - Donald Trump, just like Admiral David G Farragut, is a firm believer in the style of "Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead." With only rare exceptions, very few presidents have actually apologized for much of anything. Even Harry Truman didn't apologize that much though he did make the statement "the buck stops here."

Tera, since you might not be familiar with USA card-playing terms, I'll explain. That is a reference to "passing the buck" which, in poker, means that the person whose turn it is to deal declines to do so and therefore passes the privilege to another player. The privilege of dealing is denoted by a marker sometimes called "the buck," which moves clockwise around the table, one step per hand. But in "friendly" poker (translation: no guns on the table) the next dealer has the option to "pass the buck" if desired. The term "passing the buck" became synonymous with "not taking blame."

For what it is worth, DJT did in fact wear a mask a couple of times in the last few days.
 

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