Thinking outside the box and Cancel Culture (2 Viewers)

[Jon]

I just got banned from a crypto trading Discord server. No one gave me any warning, or any notification of what it was for. But clearly, it was based on a discussion I had that challenged the conventional wisdom of something called a "Safety Order". These Safety Orders are used to reduce the average price you pay for a cryptocurrency coin.

My polite argument essentially challenged the current view of the benefit of a Safety Order. Without going into too much detail - although I can if you want - I suggested that there is no difference between buying a Safety Order for Coin A, than just buying a similar amount of Coin B. When you look at your portfolio of coins, it makes no difference to the profit of the portfolio. This triggered multiple people in the server, one suggesting I was still at school, another saying I know nothing about finance, a third saying go watch a couple of basic videos because I know nothing, another saying I know nothing about DCA (Dollar Cost Averaging), someone else saying I am saying nothing of substance, another accusing me of being a troll. Only one guy was trying to engage me in a proper debate about the topic, although sadly he repeatedly kept misrepresenting my case and misunderstanding the logic. But at least he was making an effort.

And then, shockingly, I find that I have been permanently blocked. I had multiple people being rude to me, whilst I was just debating, and politely, a simple point that challenged the conventional wisdom.

Do you think that Cancel Culture is a disease that infects those who have no interest in discovering the truth about the world? Has it grown like weeds to strangle and engulf free thought in all aspects of society? And have you been a victim of Cancel Culture, where you have been banned or restricted from participating because you thought differently?

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Actually, I would probably have been banned sooner. To me, cryptocurrency isn't any better than 1930s Deutsche Reichsmarks. Unbacked by anything, purely speculative, only has value of a relative nature. At least in SOME economic circles, some currency is backed by the value added via labor or some other factor besides speculation. I've seen articles online that make it clear that crypto currency is a bubble waiting to burst.

 

[conception_native_0123]

And have you been a victim of Cancel Culture, where you have been banned or restricted from participating because you thought differently?

i have been banned multiple times from different forums and once from LinkedIn (although I'm back there now without them noticing). does this count??

 

[Pat Hartman]

And have you been a victim of Cancel Culture, where you have been banned or restricted from participating because you thought differently?

I may have a record of some sort. I joined FB to look for an old friend not to participate. A few days later, I was watching Lou Dobbs and his guest was carrying on about how Social Security is a Ponzi scheme and should be "cancelled". Lou wasn't arguing with him so I'm guessing that he agreed because he argues with all his guests. So, since the only way I could respond was via FB, my post went something along the lines of - If the government takes money from me for 50 years at gunpoint with the promise of giving it back when I retire, it is my money and I want it back. - I log in the next day to discover I've been banned. No recourse. No human to tell me why.

 

[KitaYama]

my post went something along the lines of - If the government takes money from me for 50 years at gunpoint with the promise of giving it back when I retire, it is my money and I want it back. - I log in the next day to discover I've been banned.

And all my life I believed US & UK are the land of free speech and freedom.
Ever since I joined AWF, a lot of my beliefs have been destroyed. And now, another one

 

[Jon]

Actually, I would probably have been banned sooner. To me, cryptocurrency isn't any better than 1930s Deutsche Reichsmarks. Unbacked by anything, purely speculative, only has value of a relative nature. At least in SOME economic circles, some currency is backed by the value added via labor or some other factor besides speculation. I've seen articles online that make it clear that crypto currency is a bubble waiting to burst.

There is a lot of misunderstanding about cryptocurrency. For example, some coins are backed. There are also things like stable coins, that are pegged to a particular currency, like the dollar. The government in India is bringing in its own cryptocurrency, pegged to the rupee.

Etherium is a "Smart Contract" platform that forms the basis for hundreds or thousands of other services that use these smart contracts. Their coin is ETH. View it as infrastructure if you like. It is not just a coin that has no inherent value. It is the basis for large numbers of services.

"Fiat" currencies (e.g. the dollar), used to be backed 100% by gold. This, as I understand it, got more and more diluted as they leveraged and printed more money. So while there is a promise to pay, backed by the government, some governments have defaulted on payments as their economies collapse. Or hyperinflation has devalued the currency so it has become worthless. There is an argument that fiat currencies have a continuum of risk based on the strength of the associated economy.

Cryptocurrencies are not backed by a government. Instead, they are backed by millions of crypto holders throughout the world, in a more distributed format. I suppose it depends on what you mean by the word "backed".

If you read any financial publications, there are those with bullish views ("the markets gonna go up!") or bearish views ("the markets going down (or about to pop!)". The current price is the equalibrium of the two views.

But if you think the whole cryptocurrency thing is going to burst, just bet short instead of long. Or in other words, jargon free, place your investment where you get a profit if the market drops. There is a misconception that you can only make money if the market goes up. That is 100% untrue. In investments, you have a choice. Bet short (going down), or long (going up).

No one knows the future, but there is $1.9 trillion invested in cryptocurrencies. People often cite the Dutch Tuplic Mania as analogous to cryptocurrencies. But the analogy is so weak, it is a bit pointless. I don't think you can do much international trade with tulips, for example!

Cryptocurrencies are the future, in my view. The only thing that can stop its rapid growth are governments, who feel the power slipping through their fingers. That is a distinct possibility, but history has shown that when you adopt a prohibitionary stance, it rarely works. End of essay!

 

[Jon]

And all my life I believed US & UK are the land of free speech and freedom.
Ever since I joined AWF, a lot of my beliefs have been destroyed. And now, another one

We are the destroyer of beliefs, and the builders of new minds! Or just a toxic over-political forum, depending on your perspective.

 

[Jon]

I may have a record of some sort. I joined FB to look for an old friend not to participate. A few days later, I was watching Lou Dobbs and his guest was carrying on about how Social Security is a Ponzi scheme and should be "cancelled". Lou wasn't arguing with him so I'm guessing that he agreed because he argues with all his guests. So, since the only way I could respond was via FB, my post went something along the lines of - If the government takes money from me for 50 years at gunpoint with the promise of giving it back when I retire, it is my money and I want it back. - I log in the next day to discover I've been banned. No recourse. No human to tell me why.

The no warning, the no recourse is an abhorrent practice in my view. These are effectively public utilities because of their size. Ostracising people (like the former president) from these platforms smacks of an authoritarianism and dictatorial culture. We are experiencing the gradual slide towards 1984.

 

[Jon]

i have been banned multiple times from different forums and once from LinkedIn (although I'm back there now without them noticing). does this count??

I've no idea why you were banned. It seems you are still able to post on this forum.

 

[conception_native_0123]

It seems you are still able to post on this forum

for now. ha.

 

[Jon]

I think some banning is fair game. For example, we had a member recently who was promoting Krishna and spouting endless vulgarities. Another was threatening the forum. And of course all the spammers. But in my case, all I was doing was having a debate about the conventional wisdom of "Safety Orders" in crypto trading. The cancel culture has become a slippery slope, where what was first used for stopping extremist views from having a platform, has instead become weaponised to stifle debate about anything that differs from your own view.

It appears that people have stopped thinking, and instead just react with cancellation. My arguments in the discussion group were mathematically and logically sound. Many of the responses were just complete misrepresentations of what I was saying. And no one presented any refutation of my hypothesis. Why? Because what I was saying was true! And it jarred with the group-think wisdom they had been following, without questioning the fundamental ideas that supported it.

I have become a little saddened at the state of current society. It seems there is a certain madness in the air. Maybe it was always there, but less stark until social media exposed it all. It seems the number of places where you can freely express your ideas is diminishing, and that those in power (the mini-Hitlers), have other ideas.

Rest assured, this forum will remain open for debate, for as long as I hold the reigns.

 

[Uncle Gizmo]

It appears that people have stopped thinking,

I don't think they actually started thinking...

It's actually a very difficult process to actually think about something deeply and correctly and I don't know many people that can do it.

I would say that this forum brings you in contact with people that do think about things, and who correct you when you start going off the rails.

 

[Jon]

I don't think they actually started thinking...

Good point. I never thought of that. (humour)

 

[conception_native_0123]

It appears that people have stopped thinking, and instead just react with cancellation.

good. can we cancel work tomorrow please?

this forum will remain open for debate, for as long as I hold the reigns.

or until a better hacker finds you a long the way. do the promise, Jon? =( I don't know what I'd do if something happened to this place! I'd feel soooo sad.

 

[Jon]

or until a better hacker finds you a long the way. do the promise, Jon? =( I don't know what I'd do if something happened to this place! I'd feel soooo sad.

We get about 10K hack attempts per day.

Source: https://www.access-programmers.co.u...ck-attempts-on-awf.313436/page-3#post-1749465

 

[conception_native_0123]

yeah but that's all automated crap Jon. I'm talking about someone who would REALLY put their time in and know how to take you down. Those in the image are just twits.

 

[Pat Hartman]

It seems there is a certain madness in the air.

To me, it seems to go back to the full court press to ban smoking. Starting in the 90's, it became socially acceptable to go beyond rude and to actually attack people who were smoking in "your world". Over the course of a couple of years, I lost two friends because I wouldn't quit smoking just because they were forced to and was personally attacked by strangers in public. Three notable instances come to mind.

1. I was in New Hampshire at a bridge tournament. There was no smoking in the hotel. It was pouring rain outside. I went out a side entrance that had a covered porch. I was standing at least 20 feet from the door. As far away from the door as I could get without standing in the rain. A "lady" came running up the walk. She opened the door and yelled over at me "I hope you die". I was too flabbergasted to even reply.
2. It was ~ 3 in the afternoon. I was the only patron in a restaurant where they had divided into smoking and non-smoking sections and had installed plexiglass dividers to separate the two sections - we know how affective they are because the COVID police had everyone install them to separate themselves from the public. The smoking side of the divider was two tables wide. I was sitting at a table against the wall and so it was as far from the divider and the non-smoking section as I could physically get and it was as far back as I could go. I couldn't get further away from the bulk of the non-smoking section and still be in the restaurant. A couple with two small children entered the restaurant. Looked around at the 40 tables they had to choose from and made a beeline for the table that was closest to me but on their side of the plexiglass and sat down. As soon as they were settled, they started coughing and waving their hands around to wave the smoke away and made loud, rude comments about me smoking where there were children in the room.
3. It was 4th of July, My family and a couple of friends had gone to the river to a dock from which we could watch the fireworks. The doc was a T. The long part was probably 100 feet and the short part was at least 50 feet and about 10 feet lower than the upper dock since the tide was out. There were a couple of bunches of people on the upper level. We went all the way to the end to the lower level which was empty and went to the far end of that so no one would need to walk past us. We only had one non-smoker with us that day, my baby brother. We were sitting around and a couple with two children came up to the dock in their small, open speedboat. Guess where they parked. Not hard here. Right in front of my group. The man stood up and yelled at us to stop smoking next to his boat. My baby brother stood up and told him to move his boat to the other end of the dock and no one would be smoking next to his boat. The older brother (the middle child) stood up and flicked his butt over the guy's head and into the water. The guy moved his boat.

I quit smoking over 20 years ago but still have several friends who can't give it up. I keep ashtrays in my house so they can smoke. We open a window and turn on the fan if it gets too smoky in the house.

 

[Jon]

yeah but that's all automated crap Jon. I'm talking about someone who would REALLY put their time in and know how to take you down. Those in the image are just twits.

How do you know its all automated? You've only seen a snippet. But in any case, hacking risk applies to everything, like the Pentagon, NASA and you personally. Don't worry about what you can't control.

 

[conception_native_0123]

How do you know its all automated?

well, for the one thing the page visited is the same for every record. isn't what we are seeing in your image just similar to automated hack attempts on wordpress back-end log in pages? I've had discussions about this for years with GoDaddy agents. The systems are already set up underground. they just need to find the right sucker who doesn't know how to keep security up-to-date, and boom, they're in. no?

 

[Jon]

well, for the one thing the page visited is the same for every record. isn't what we are seeing in your image just similar to automated hack attempts on wordpress back-end log in pages? I've had discussions about this for years with GoDaddy agents. The systems are already set up underground. they just need to find the right sucker who doesn't know how to keep security up-to-date, and boom, they're in. no?

Is this more to your taste?

Source: https://www.access-programmers.co.u...ant-hack-attempts-on-awf.313436/#post-1715579

Edit: The bulk is likely to be automated, but not all. WordPress bots go crazy but there are bots that also go for forum software too. vBulletin was notorious for vulnerabilities.