Trump Administration Predictions (6 Viewers)

[Pat Hartman]

Don't his own people pretty much loathe him?

Just like Americans are taught by the media to loathe Trump?

No matter how you disguise it, is still Crime Against Humanity.

Then why do you criticize Israel? They are not the ones committing ethnic cleansing. Their constitution doesn't say "kill all the Muslims". Their citizens don't march in the street shooting guns saying "death to America", "death to the Jews". It is Islam that commands Muslims to Convert, Subjugate, or Kill all non-believers. How do you think Islam was spread? You really need to go back to some actual history books. The Jews don't proselytize and so they don't grow by getting converts at all. They accept converts but they do not seek them. Most of the various Christian sects proselytize but they preach the Gospel of Jesus which is all about peace and love, not about war and conquest and killing as Islam is.

Genocide, Ethnic Cleansing, ... No matter how you disguise it, is still Crime Against Humanity.

So, in your mind, the Jews must just lay down and die? They are not allowed to fight back? Or they are only allowed to fight back if it meets YOUR standards of the Marquess of Queensbury rules? Then they should probably just line up for the gas chambers now. That was supposed to be their fate if Hitler won WWII. The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem was coordinating the "final solution" with Hitler's henchmen for implementation in the Middle East.

 

[Pat Hartman]

That seems to be the norm in these threads. Both sides are as closed minded as the side they accuse each other of being, yet refuse to see it.

How do you make that equation? One side is totally ignorant of actual historical facts. Pesky details, I know. Sorry, but you seem to be devoid of historical knowledge also given that statement.

The Palestinians have squandered every opportunity to have a state of their own. They want it all - "from the river to the sea". They will not settle for Jews having any presence at all. In fact, there have been active pogroms throughout the Middle East for more than a century to rid ALL of the countries of Jews and Christians and Buddhists, etc. This is not just a problem with Palestinians. Lebanon was once a free and democratic country with a mostly Christian population. Not anymore. The Palestinians took over and persecuted the Christians almost to extinction. Same with the Buddhists of Afghanistan. The Muslims went so far as to destroy all statues of Buddha obliterating historical monuments. They have also desecrated many ancient archaeological sites because they consider them to be an abomination to Islam and not to mention to dig up artifacts to sell on the black market. Money is money after all

 

[Pat Hartman]

I certainly hope there are no Muslim or Palestinian children reading these forums.

You should probably worry more about the Jews among us. Not sure at all why you would worry about children. Do you know any who are interested in Access?

 

[Pat Hartman]

Maybe someone (Israel) should arm the Palestinians so they could fight back against Hamas presumably they don't like being used as human shields. That would atleast show they are willing to fight back and do some of the work internally.

Do you think Israel hasn't suggested that? Hatred dies hard. The Palestinians are taught from birth to count by counting dead Jews. They cannot see any solution where all the Jews are not dead or at least gone. They do not see how their own hatred has caused their pain. They just hate harder. They never think about what they could have done after ~2004 when they were "free" of Israeli control. They never envisioned what their country should be. All they wanted was to kill all the Jews.

They would fight until every single one of them is dead if they hadn't succumbed to the pressure from the other Muslim countries.

 

[RogerCooper]

Their constitution doesn't say "kill all the Muslims".

Israel does not have a constitution. It does have the "Prevention of Infiltration Law" which criminalizes the return of refugees.

 

[Pat Hartman]

Israel does not have a constitution. It does have the "Prevention of Infiltration Law" which criminalizes the return of refugees.

Have you ever asked yourself why? Perhaps you could compare this to Roosevelt's decision to put all people of Japanese descent into concentration camps. WE took their businesses. WE took their homes. They were never adequately compensated for their losses. And it turns out that they really weren't the enemy within. That isn't true for the Palestinians. They flatly refuse to coexist peacefully with the Jews. They were the ones who abandoned their homes and businesses because they believed the propaganda that the Jews would persecute them if they stayed. That never happened. Everyone who stayed is a fully integrated Israeli. They participate in government and military and business and when asked, they acknowledge that they prefer to be Israeli than move to a Muslim nation. Israel did expel Palestinians who actively worked against them once the 1948 war ended.

I have said many times that this might have been the worst mistake the Jews ever made. It made permanent enemies of all the refugees which turned out to be in perpetuity because of what the UN did to create a "special" Palestinian refugee commission to make sure that the wound never healed. Normally, when a war ends and the lines are drawn, you are where you are but that did not happen in this case. The Palestinians who fled Israel and those who were expelled for collaboration with the enemy in 1948 were never allowed to integrate. Israel would not take them back and their host country would not accept them as citizens. They became people without a country and that status still exists almost 80 years later. Of course the wounds are deep. You just can't blame the entire problem on Israel as you seem to be.

But consider the situation from Israel's point of view. Israel had just been attacked by all the surrounding Muslim countries who were out to destroy Israel. They barely survived and the Palestinians did not survive!!!!! Egypt annexed Gaza and Jordan annexed Samaria and Judea. Should Israel allow back in the country people who willingly left even though it was under false pretenses? The state of Israel was very fragile, why would they want such large numbers of the enemy living within their borders? My opinion, they should have allowed the people who willingly left back in but held the line on those who were expelled for collaboration. Fixing the property rights would have been a nightmare and I'm sure that was a consideration also.

 

[Thales750]

How do you make that equation? One side is totally ignorant of actual historical facts. Pesky details, I know. Sorry, but you seem to be devoid of historical knowledge also given that statement.

The Palestinians have squandered every opportunity to have a state of their own. They want it all - "from the river to the sea". They will not settle for Jews having any presence at all. In fact, there have been active pogroms throughout the Middle East for more than a century to rid ALL of the countries of Jews and Christians and Buddhists, etc. This is not just a problem with Palestinians. Lebanon was once a free and democratic country with a mostly Christian population. Not anymore. The Palestinians took over and persecuted the Christians almost to extinction. Same with the Buddhists of Afghanistan. The Muslims went so far as to destroy all statues of Buddha obliterating historical monuments. They have also desecrated many ancient archaeological sites because they consider them to be an abomination to Islam and not to mention to dig up artifacts to sell on the black market. Money is money after all

Pat, you are pretty much the finest example on this entire forum, and in these long months of discussions, as being the most closed-minded person of all.
And it goes beyond just your political beliefs, it also extends well into your ideas on how software should be developed. I noticed that part years ago, so maybe you should take a look and see if you're not one of those people with an absolutely closed mind.

 

[Thales750]

No! the palestinian people writ large did not have an 'option'. Many of them are innocent casualties of this war, which consists of Israel using a hatchet instead of a scalpel and just blowing everyone to bits.

I meant everyone in power.

 

[Thales750]

The Palestinians are taught from birth to count by counting dead Jews.

Pat, seriously?

 

[Steve R.]

The Palestinians are being taught from birth to kill Jews. This is old now, so its relevance may be suspect.
Nevertheless it is indicative of the Palestinians endlessly advocating genocide against the Jews.

PS: The search results exposed bias as the results tended to "push" websites favorable to the Palestinians as being victims instead of being the aggressors.

 

[Steve R.]

Genocide, Ethnic Cleansing, ... No matter how you disguise it, is still Crime Against Humanity. That's why I still say Israel's leadership is no better than the Nazi's were.

Again, your diatribes only focus on condemning Israel. Very occasionally you toss-out gratuitous remarks concerning Hamas just to provide some faux acknowledgement, but clearly you don't care about Hamas committing crimes against humanity.

Furthermore, if you cared about crimes against humanity, there are plenty of Islamic countries committing those crimes and you ignore those since you are so anti-Israel. Not only that, but our illustrative UN, which is supposed to be a peace keeping humanitarian agency, is itself antisemitic. They had many years to disarm Hamas and Hezbollah but failed to do that.

 

[BlueSpruce]

Just like Americans are taught by the media to loathe Trump?

Then why do you criticize Israel? They are not the ones committing ethnic cleansing. Their constitution doesn't say "kill all the Muslims". Their citizens don't march in the street shooting guns saying "death to America", "death to the Jews". It is Islam that commands Muslims to Convert, Subjugate, or Kill all non-believers. How do you think Islam was spread? You really need to go back to some actual history books. The Jews don't proselytize and so they don't grow by getting converts at all. They accept converts but they do not seek them. Most of the various Christian sects proselytize but they preach the Gospel of Jesus which is all about peace and love, not about war and conquest and killing as Islam is.

So, in your mind, the Jews must just lay down and die? They are not allowed to fight back? Or they are only allowed to fight back if it meets YOUR standards of the Marquess of Queensbury rules? Then they should probably just line up for the gas chambers now. That was supposed to be their fate if Hitler won WWII. The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem was coordinating the "final solution" with Hitler's henchmen for implementation in the Middle East.

I have already said everything I wanted to say about this topic, and once again stand firmly behind my beliefs. You can continue to thrive on this chaos, whereas I'm done. Time will tell what happens to Israel and the Palestinians. Truth and justice prevails sooner or later.

 

[Thales750]

And now, a direct assault on the very foundation of American freedoms and liberty. How long will you stand by and drink the cool aid?

Journalists turn in access badges, exit Pentagon rather than agree to new reporting rules

Journalists at the Pentagon turned in access badges and cleaned out their workspaces, the price for refusing to agree to new restrictions on their jobs at the seat of U.S. military power.

apnews.com

 

[The_Doc_Man]

And now, a direct assault on the very foundation of American freedoms and liberty. How long will you stand by and drink the cool aid?

Journalists turn in access badges, exit Pentagon rather than agree to new reporting rules

Journalists at the Pentagon turned in access badges and cleaned out their workspaces, the price for refusing to agree to new restrictions on their jobs at the seat of U.S. military power.

apnews.com

I would be very surprised if someone doesn't file suit on this one. Pete H. DOES have the right to try to control what HIS people do, but the press corps doesn't work for him. THEY are paid by private organizations dedicated to getting stories. If Pete wants to make it a firing offense for someone to talk "off the record" then he CAN do that. But the press corps is one of the "checks and balances" in which people are kept informed about what is going on. They happen to have a constitutional amendment in their favor and they ALSO have "whistleblower laws" to protect people who see something and say something.

Thales750, I've never been a Kool-Aid drinker. Some things that have happened under DJT just don't matter to me; other things, I actually agree with. And some things I think need to go even farther than they already have. But I spot-disagree with you and sometimes spot-agree with you. This is the way with people... we don't all think alike. Were you expecting something else? You have found a topic where we agree. Whoop-de-doo, but next time we might disagree again. It happens.

 

[Steve R.]

And now, a direct assault on the very foundation of American freedoms and liberty. How long will you stand by and drink the cool aid?

Journalists turn in access badges, exit Pentagon rather than agree to new reporting rules

Journalists at the Pentagon turned in access badges and cleaned out their workspaces, the price for refusing to agree to new restrictions on their jobs at the seat of U.S. military power.

apnews.com

The "direct assault on the very foundation of American freedoms and liberty" has come from a dishonest press during the Obama/Biden presidencies. According to some surveys, the press is 90+% biased against the Trump administration. The press is not reporting truthfully. Jim Acosta during Trump's first term only made abusive adversarial accusations instead of asking valid questions. We don't need a Jim Acosta purposely disrupting Pentagon press briefings as an operative for the Democratic party. Then there is the case of James Comey who used a New York Times reporter to leak classified information. The news media needs to clean-up its act and report the news to uphold the "very foundation of American freedoms and liberty" instead of being the propaganda arm for the Democratic party.

The Biden administration stiff-armed social media to suppress conservative voices. They even attempted to set-up an Orwellian Ministry of Truth. I will also close with the Hunter Biden laptop scandal were the government and the media were complicit in suppressing stories that would hurt the Democratic party agenda. That scandal was a "direct assault on the very foundation of American freedoms and liberty".

 

[NauticalGent]

How do you make that equation?

As you just proved, it is obvious to the most casual observer.

Sorry, but you seem to be devoid of historical knowledge also given that statement.

And you are an embarrassment. The very tactics you accuse the liberals/democrats of - name calling, questioning the integrity and intelligence of anyone you may have a different opinion of yours - are the very tactics you employ. But because it's YOU, somehow it's different.

You should really stick the to technical aspects of this forum, you are of no value here.

 

[NauticalGent]

Pat, you are pretty much the finest example on this entire forum, and in these long months of discussions, as being the most closed-minded person of all.

 

[RogerCooper]

Have you ever asked yourself why? Perhaps you could compare this to Roosevelt's decision to put all people of Japanese descent into concentration camps. WE took their businesses. WE took their homes. They were never adequately compensated for their losses. And it turns out that they really weren't the enemy within. That isn't true for the Palestinians. They flatly refuse to coexist peacefully with the Jews. They were the ones who abandoned their homes and businesses because they believed the propaganda that the Jews would persecute them if they stayed. That never happened. Everyone who stayed is a fully integrated Israeli. They participate in government and military and business and when asked, they acknowledge that they prefer to be Israeli than move to a Muslim nation. Israel did expel Palestinians who actively worked against them once the 1948 war ended.

I have said many times that this might have been the worst mistake the Jews ever made. It made permanent enemies of all the refugees which turned out to be in perpetuity because of what the UN did to create a "special" Palestinian refugee commission to make sure that the wound never healed. Normally, when a war ends and the lines are drawn, you are where you are but that did not happen in this case. The Palestinians who fled Israel and those who were expelled for collaboration with the enemy in 1948 were never allowed to integrate. Israel would not take them back and their host country would not accept them as citizens. They became people without a country and that status still exists almost 80 years later. Of course the wounds are deep. You just can't blame the entire problem on Israel as you seem to be.

But consider the situation from Israel's point of view. Israel had just been attacked by all the surrounding Muslim countries who were out to destroy Israel. They barely survived and the Palestinians did not survive!!!!! Egypt annexed Gaza and Jordan annexed Samaria and Judea. Should Israel allow back in the country people who willingly left even though it was under false pretenses? The state of Israel was very fragile, why would they want such large numbers of the enemy living within their borders? My opinion, they should have allowed the people who willingly left back in but held the line on those who were expelled for collaboration. Fixing the property rights would have been a nightmare and I'm sure that was a consideration also.

Some Palestinians left voluntarily while others were expelled by the Haganah and the Irgun (the Irgun-led massacre at Deir Yassin was designed to frighten the Palestinians into leaving).

As you stated it was a serious mistake by the Israeli government to not allow the refugees to return. I don't blame this on Israel, I blame it on the Israeli government leadership at the time, especially Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion. To quote Ben-Gurion

Why should the Arabs make peace? If I was an Arab leader I would never make terms with Israel. That is natural: we have taken their country. Sure, God promised it to us, but what does that matter to them? Our God is not theirs. We come from Israel, it's true, but two thousand years ago, and what is that to them? There has been anti-Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault? They only see one thing: we have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that?

 

[Pat Hartman]

Pat, you are pretty much the finest example on this entire forum, and in these long months of discussions, as being the most closed-minded person of all.
And it goes beyond just your political beliefs, it also extends well into your ideas on how software should be developed. I noticed that part years ago, so maybe you should take a look and see if you're not one of those people with an absolutely closed mind.

Your opinion is your opinion. I would make a note but I can't find my pen. If I insist on history being recognized then I guess that makes me closed minded. What happened in 1948 happened. Deny it all you want. What happened in 1967 happened. Deny it all you want. What happened ~ 2004 happened. Deny it all you want. What happened on Oct 7th, 2023, happened. Deny it all you want. Ignore the videos taken by the terrorists themselves. What happened, happened. Too bad you don't know any of what has happened to bring us to the current conundrum. And what's worse, you don't want to. Very sad. Sorry if I can't respect your uninformed opinions.

You should really stick the to technical aspects of this forum, you are of no value here.

Apparently you are correct. None of the Hamas supporters here are even the least bit interested in actual history. I've posted many historical summaries and links to official history such as what is found at Britannica. But you keep your head in the sand and continue to support terrorists. Even reading the summary of all of the dozens of attacks Israel has faced since 1948 from their Muslim neighbors should be eye opening.

Pointing out your ignorance of history is simply stating a fact. You may view it as an attack but it isn't. It's a wakeup call to get yourself informed about the people you are supporting. Ignorance can be cured. It is only permanent when you make a conscious decision to dig in your heels and not get the facts. Israel has made many mistakes but they are not the underlying villain. And if you read the attack/invasion summaries, Israel is always the victim. Even in 1967. When the armies of six of Israel's Muslim neighbors were massing on Israel's borders, Israel decided to not lay down and play dead waiting for the inevitable so they attacked first and won the war decisively in six days. There's that pesky history again. Please feel free to ignore it.

Moke points out my ignorance of the law quite freely. Sadly, he also supports not enforcing laws he doesn't like but that may be because his job is to defend criminals who break laws so they are simply inconveniences rather than in place to protect the non-criminals in our society.

 

[RogerCooper]

Your opinion is your opinion. I would make a note but I can't find my pen. If I insist on history being recognized then I guess that makes me closed minded. What happened in 1948 happened. Deny it all you want. What happened in 1967 happened. Deny it all you want. What happened ~ 2004 happened. Deny it all you want. What happened on Oct 7th, 2023, happened. Deny it all you want. Ignore the videos taken by the terrorists themselves. What happened, happened. Too bad you don't know any of what has happened to bring us to the current conundrum. And what's worse, you don't want to. Very sad. Sorry if I can't respect your uninformed opinions.

Apparently you are correct. None of the Hamas supporters here are even the least bit interested in actual history. I've posted many historical summaries and links to official history such as what is found at Britannica. But you keep your head in the sand and continue to support terrorists. Even reading the summary of all of the dozens of attacks Israel has faced since 1948 from their Muslim neighbors should be eye opening.

Pointing out your ignorance of history is simply stating a fact. You may view it as an attack but it isn't. It's a wakeup call to get yourself informed about the people you are supporting. Ignorance can be cured. It is only permanent when you make a conscious decision to dig in your heels and not get the facts. Israel has made many mistakes but they are not the underlying villain. And if you read the attack/invasion summaries, Israel is always the victim. Even in 1967. When the armies of six of Israel's Muslim neighbors were massing on Israel's borders, Israel decided to not lay down and play dead waiting for the inevitable so they attacked first and won the war decisively in six days. There's that pesky history again. Please feel free to ignore it.

Moke points out my ignorance of the law quite freely. Sadly, he also supports not enforcing laws he doesn't like but that may be because his job is to defend criminals who break laws so they are simply inconveniences rather than in place to protect the non-criminals in our society.

In 1967, the Arab armies were not massed on Israel's borders. The casus belli was the Egyptian blockade of the Straits of Tiran. A sufficient justification for attacking Egypt and it's ally Syria but it was not a preemptive strike.

As for Hamas supporters, let's quote Israel Information Minister.

Netanyahu not only adopted this way of thinking, he also added to it the preservation of Hamas rule in Gaza as a tool for strengthening the separation between the strip and the West Bank. In 2018, for example, he agreed that Qatar would transfer millions of dollars a year to finance the Hamas government in Gaza, embodying the comments made in 2015 by Bezalel Smotrich (then a marginal Knesset member, and today the finance minister and de facto West Bank overlord) that “the Palestinian Authority is a burden and Hamas is an asset.”

“Netanyahu wants Hamas on its feet and is ready to pay an almost unimaginable price for it: half the country paralyzed, children and parents traumatized, houses bombed, people killed,” Israel’s current information minister, Galit Distel Atbaryan, wrote in May 2019, when she was yet to enter politics but was known as a prominent Netanyahu supporter. “And Netanyahu, in a kind of outrageous, almost unimaginable restraint, does not do the easiest thing: getting the IDF to overthrow the organization.

“The question is, why?” Distel Atbaryan continued, before explaining: “If Hamas collapses, Abu Mazen [Mahmoud Abbas] may control the strip. If he controls it, there will be voices from the left that will encourage negotiations and a political solution and a Palestinian state, also in Judea and Samaria [the West Bank] … This is the real reason why Netanyahu does not eliminate the Hamas leader, everything else is bullshit.”

Yes, Netanyahu was a Hamas supporter.