Interesting artical about what government can and can't do. It's a bit longish, but worth the read.

[Isaac]

So you disagree with possibly the richest country in the world (USA) helping third world countries by supplying aid. How caring you are.
If you don't like it, why not become an elected government minister and do something about it instead of moaning on continuously about how useless the government/president is?
Col

We show our caring by voluntarily donating more charity per capita than any country in the world.

 

[Isaac]

The key is, voluntarily

 

[Steve R.]

So you disagree with possibly the richest country in the world (USA) helping third world countries by supplying aid. How caring you are.

The US may be "rich", but money only goes so far. The US is spending more money that it takes in and is going bankrupt. When it comes to spending, the US is addicted and has no self control. Moreover, Western North Carolina was just devastated. Coastal Southern California is getting burnt to the ground. The US needs to take of itself first.

 

[ColinEssex]

We show our caring by voluntarily donating more charity per capita than any country in the world.

That isn't what I referred to.
Col

 

[moke123]

We show our caring by voluntarily donating more charity per capita than any country in the world.

According to the Charities Aid Foundation's (CAF) World Giving Index, Indonesia is the most generous country in the world. Indonesia has held this title for seven years in a row.

 

[NauticalGent]

When the government takes money from me to give to someone it deems more worthy, it is not charity, it is theft.

Amen, amen and AMEN.

 

[Isaac]

That isn't what I referred to.
Col

I know. You omitted it, which is why I had to point it out

 

[ColinEssex]

How many charities do you volunteer for? Do you develop free software for them? Do you help out in food kitchens or read to children in the library?

As usual, you choose to assume that I am evil and uncaring.

1) what I do or give to charities is private. I don't brag about it like you.
2) if you are evil (and I have never said you are), that makes two of us because you called me evil amongst your string of verbal abuse you sent me.
Col

 

[ColinEssex]

I think it's best I step back from your fantasy world. Your attempt at provoking a response so you can again threaten me with a ban is so obvious.
Col

 

[Thales750]

An absurd prostration. The poor don't pay taxes. In many cases they receive negative taxes (better know as welfare). Consequently the only people who would receive a Republican tax benefit would be rich people. How do you cut taxes of people who pay no taxes?

To be fair, even the poor should pay some taxes. After all, if they don't have "skin-in-the-game", they will have no interest in having a government that spends tax money efficiently.

PS: You also neglect the obvious question of cutting federal spending. The issue shouldn't be always increasing spending as the solution, but actually cutting federal spending by eliminating unnecessary programs. Even implementing austerity, as an extreme example.

Poor people do pay taxes. They pay sales tax and they directly or indirectly pay property tax.
If they are homeless, well they still pay some sales tax.

 

[Thales750]

@Thales750 Apparently you are unaware of this but both sales taxes and property taxes go to the local communities or the state, not to the Federal government.

I did not say Federal taxes. Is English your second language? Or, is it just a life long habit to jump to conclusions? Maybe it's just the cool aid talking.

 

[Thales750]

And yet you find no problem accusing me of being selfish and unfeeling. Then when I explain that I do contribute to charities with both time and money, you accuse me of bragging. Isn't that a little unfair even by your standards?

That is very commendable. No sarcasm intended. Having close relationships with a lot of Texas Conservatives, I find them to be overall, very moral, and giving folks.

 

[Steve R.]

Poor people do pay taxes. They pay sales tax and they directly or indirectly pay property tax.
If they are homeless, well they still pay some sales tax.

Again, to a degree that is an absurd proposition. They may "pay" taxes (in a sense), but many poor receive subsidies from federal, state, and NGO's, (better known as welfare) so the supposed taxes they are paying is derived from money that was given to them by other people and organizations. So the money that is supposedly used to pay taxes comes not from their work efforts, but the work efforts of other people.

 

[Thales750]

An absurd prostration. The poor don't pay taxes. In many cases they receive negative taxes (better know as welfare). Consequently the only people who would receive a Republican tax benefit would be rich people. How do you cut taxes of people who pay no taxes?

To be fair, even the poor should pay some taxes. After all, if they don't have "skin-in-the-game", they will have no interest in having a government that spends tax money efficiently.

PS: You also neglect the obvious question of cutting federal spending. The issue shouldn't be always increasing spending as the solution, but actually cutting federal spending by eliminating unnecessary programs. Even implementing austerity, as an extreme example.

This is literally the absolute worst Republican Cool Aid I have seen in this long drawn out discussion.

Again, to a degree that is an absurd proposition. They may "pay" taxes (in a sense), but many poor receive subsidies from federal, state, and NGO's, (better known as welfare) so the supposed taxes they are paying is derived from money that was given to them by other people and organizations. So the money that is supposedly used to pay taxes comes not from their work efforts, but the work efforts of other people.

I was merely correcting you on your statement. the poor do pay taxes, and since they have to spend every dime at the store or on rent, a substantial portion of their income does go to taxes.

The subsidies you speak of, they have among the highest economic multiplier effect on our economy.

 

[Steve R.]

I was merely correcting you on your statement. the poor do pay taxes, and since they have to spend every dime at the store or on rent, a substantial portion of their income does go to taxes.

So when a parent gives a child money to buy candy, that constitutes the kid paying taxes? You are playing word games.

 

[Isaac]

This is literally the absolute worst Republican Cool Aid I have seen in this long drawn out discussion.

I was merely correcting you on your statement. the poor do pay taxes, and since they have to spend every dime at the store or on rent, a substantial portion of their income does go to taxes.

The subsidies you speak of, they have among the highest economic multiplier effect on our economy.

@Thales750 don't you sometimes feel, though, like the block of people who are increasingly dependent on the government is getting bigger? In a way such an assertion is almost an inherent one from your overall perspective that the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer, or the inequality gap, or whatever it's called.

I guess our differences are how to deal with that. Some people say tax the rich more and give the poor people even more government stuff.
Other people say there is a fundamental attitude problem that leads too many people to almost prefer gov dependence instead of making the hard-but-right decisions that get them ahead.
My problem is that the bigger the block gets that depends on the government, the bigger the voting block gets that will just keep voting for policies that keep paying for an increasing poor block's survival from successful people's money......You see where this is going, ultimately it would be unsustainable as it only scales so far. And that's not to mention fairness perspective, I'm just talking about the pot of available $ to take from.

I take a lot from my own experiences, growing up poor and being 'ok' but paycheck to paycheck for a lot of my life until at least my upper 30's.
Basically it was all my own fault, and as soon as I made more right decisions over an extended period of time, I found a more comfortable level of income and I feel like the vast majority of poor people could do that. I realize some can't, if you are a quadruple amputee all you can do is sit and depend on others - but i'm talking about the vast majority who are poor simply because they go from job to job, never really put in what it takes to climb the ladder, don't put that extra effort into learning a skill, etc. A lot of people just choose that life, I know I did for a time.

 

[Thales750]

@Thales750 don't you sometimes feel, though, like the block of people who are increasingly dependent on the government is getting bigger? In a way such an assertion is almost an inherent one from your overall perspective that the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer, or the inequality gap, or whatever it's called.

I guess our differences are how to deal with that. Some people say tax the rich more and give the poor people even more government stuff.
Other people say there is a fundamental attitude problem that leads too many people to almost prefer gov dependence instead of making the hard-but-right decisions that get them ahead.
My problem is that the bigger the block gets that depends on the government, the bigger the voting block gets that will just keep voting for policies that keep paying for an increasing poor block's survival from successful people's money......You see where this is going, ultimately it would be unsustainable as it only scales so far. And that's not to mention fairness perspective, I'm just talking about the pot of available $ to take from.

I take a lot from my own experiences, growing up poor and being 'ok' but paycheck to paycheck for a lot of my life until at least my upper 30's.
Basically it was all my own fault, and as soon as I made more right decisions over an extended period of time, I found a more comfortable level of income and I feel like the vast majority of poor people could do that. I realize some can't, if you are a quadruple amputee all you can do is sit and depend on others - but i'm talking about the vast majority who are poor simply because they go from job to job, never really put in what it takes to climb the ladder, don't put that extra effort into learning a skill, etc. A lot of people just choose that life, I know I did for a time.

This statement could be a synopsis of a long and complicated book. It would be nice if we could (the folks here) actually move this conversation to discussing the details of these issues and perspectives.

I personally would find it fascinating, or at least interesting,