Compliance gone mad

[GaryPanic]

I know it seems daft - but I have just been on a writing course , and the focus of this course was to ensure that the message you were trying to get accrss, comes accross as to puntuation, the course lead to say that comma's and fullstops are slowing merging and the use of semi-colons and commons again are merging, - they discussed this and said that grammer is a moving enity and old school grammer rules are being changes (old school being the "correct" style of grammer which we are discussiong/arguing about here), Modern grammer (or grammer full stop) was going down to a base level .

however the course did point out that any communication between two parties should be on a common level - ir if a customer complains to you and there grammer is shot to pieces then you should address your letter to this level (no fancy wording, plain english..etc.) clear and concise
where as if you had a letter from say someone of a higher educated level and they have got technical or fancy english , then you could address your letter and style to this level should you wish to, as long as your response tot he enquiry/complaint etc was clear and that the other side would understand what you were talking about.

 

[GaryPanic]

if you read my post abopve - you can see what I mean about my level of grammer etc - more typo and comma's int he wrong place --
but hopefully the intent comes accross

g

 

[chergh]

Like using a capital "E" for the word "English"?


Shouldn't that read

"except that instead of it being only available to a limited audience"?

Also, isn't taking peoples' comments out of context not only rude, but incorrect?

Don't critisise me until you can be sure you're on the right track - at the moment you're not even parallel track. You take a comment, cut it to suit your so called syndrome then spend an hour having a go at me.

Get out more son, you may learn something

Col

Why don't you try addressing the point. Your the one trying to say poor grammar is going to lead to the death of correct English yet you fail to use correct English yourself.

Therefore using your own logic you yourself and helping to destroy "correct English".

My original point, which I failed to make, was supposed to be if your going to make a big deal about the correct use of grammar you should make damned sure your own grammar is correct.

I don't always use correct english, I'm quite happy to admit that, but I'm also not going around saying that that it's going to result in the death of the language.

Apart from anything else languages naturally evolve (or are intelligently designed for our American readers) over time. Correct english today in no way resembles correct english a couple of hundred years ago. I'm also quite sure that english in a couple of hundred years from now will be quite different to what we have today.

Textspeak really is no big deal, and is a poor cousing of l33t speak anyway

 

[Rich]

Modern grammer (or grammer full stop) was going down to a base level .

But our goverment claims on an almost daily basis that it has drastically improved the education of our youth; is it lying? I know for a fact that it's claim to having reduced class sizes is a lie

 

[Rich]

Textspeak really is no big deal, and is a poor cousing of l33t speak anyway

I note that you haven't answered my questions on the subject.

 

[GaryPanic]

Capital E on english -
if talking about the langauge then small e, if talking about the people of England then large E
its the same rule for church and Church the first is the building the second the people so the Church of England (correct) and St.Thomas church (building)correct... and the congregation would be St. Thomas Church

I know its a small point - but it's one I know of.

also the Capital of England is E not London the capital city of England is ...
small thing but this has always annoyed me...

amazing what pushes peoples buttons....
g

 

[chergh]

Surely it's more important to try all the time to be correct and not just lazy, which is something you appear to be endorsing, or is it new technology that's responsible in your view?

N.B. the grammar and spelling have been verified as correct by the Microsoft Corporation

If I'm sending a text message or an email to my girlfriend I don't believe it is more important to be correct. I might use slang in my email or text, I might completely ignore punctuation, I might even use use some textspeak It really doesn't matter. I believe the effects of people using textspeak and incorrect grammar are going to be virtually nothing and certainly not the death of correct english.

The only time I make sure I use grammatically correct english is when I writing buisness emails or writing letters to lawyers, banks etc.

Technology does what we tell it to do so "technology" in itself can't be responsible for anything.

My whole point is if you believe poor grammar etc. are going to result in the death of correct english then you should be making sure you are using correct english to prevent this, and not be suprised when you get picked up on it not being correct.

If you dont believe poor grammar etc. is going to impact upon correct english then it doesn't matter how you write emails or texts as when you need to use correct english you will still be able to.

 

[Rich]

Technology does what we tell it to do so "technology" in itself can't be responsible for anything.

But if the technology makes it too difficult to communicate correctly who's responsible, the Japs.?

 

[Rich]

also the Capital of England is E not London the capital city of England is ...
small thing but this has always annoyed me...

Small point, but that should be "the capital letter of England is E"

 

[GaryPanic]

noted - but usually the questions is what is the capital of England

 

[chergh]

But if the technology makes it too difficult to communicate correctly who's responsible, the Japs.?

The technology just sends the data it's upto the users to be able to enter the information in an intelligible format.

 

[ColinEssex]

Why don't you try addressing the point. Your the one trying to say poor grammar is going to lead to the death of correct English yet you fail to use correct English yourself.

yes, bad grammar in texts. All people have different levels of grammar - some are a pain about it and have to show they're maybe greater in some way, others not. Wait till the Yanks start posting, you and your syndrome will have a field day

All I'm saying is the current trend for using textspeak in texts could lead to the younger element using it in inappropriate areas like a discussion forum. That would be sad.

How do you feel about people who take things out of context then base a pointless argument on their misinterpretaion of the phrase?

How do you feel about people who call others names like "a grammar nazi"? offensive?

How do you feel about people who pick up on minute errors in grammar yet make them themselves?

Get the stick out of your own eye before you poke mine. You get your grammar right and maybe I'll listen more to your pointless ramblings, it's a shade more interesting than watching grass grow.

Col

 

[GaryPanic]

Capital of England ?
capital Church - Canterbury
Capital Port -Dover/Liverpool/ etc
its an assuption thay they person asking means city.. howver it is left open to the person answering that they can interpurt this to mean something else - I know its petty - but boy does it tick me off...

 

[Rich]

The technology just sends the data it's upto the users to be able to enter the information in an intelligible format.

Exactly my point, it's the users who have become too lazy to try and send texts in a correct manner, it was you who blamed the limitations of the technology in the first place though

 

[chergh]

Exactly my point, it's the users who have become too lazy to try and send texts in a correct manner, it was you who blamed the limitations of the technology in the first place though

No the users adapted to the limitation of the technology.

The limitation of the technology, as I perceive them, were as follows:

1. Poor interface for typing

2. Limited message size

The users developed textspeak to compensate for these and this method has continued even as the technology has advanced. Textspeak has to some extent become a habit and users like to stick to what they are familiar with. I wouldn't necessarily call this laziness.

 

[Rich]

Capital of England ?
...

Well it should of course be Birmingham

 

[Rich]

No the users adapted to the limitation of the technology.

The limitation of the technology, as I perceive them, were as follows:

1. Poor interface for typing

2. Limited message size

The users developed textspeak to compensate for these and this method has continued even as the technology has advanced. Textspeak has to some extent become a habit and users like to stick to what they are familiar with. I wouldn't necessarily call this laziness.

Have you ever seen any letters/postgrams or whatever they were called sent home from the front during WWII? There is no excuse for laziness.

 

[chergh]

All I'm saying is the current trend for using textspeak in texts could lead to the younger element using it in inappropriate areas like a discussion forum. That would be sad.

No what you said was " in 5 years correct English grammar will be obsolete ". if this is your view you should be using correct grammar the whole time but you don't and I picked you upon it because you wrote was utterly sensationalist. If you advocate correct grammar in such a way i'm going to call you on it when you don't use correct grammar.

How do you feel about people who take things out of context then base a pointless argument on their misinterpretaion of the phrase?

While I did Take what you said out of context the underlying point is still valid. You want people to use correct grammar but don't use it yourself.

How do you feel about people who call others names like "a grammar nazi"? offensive?

It's just me being hypocritical in being sensationalist myself but your view that people should use correct grammar has echoes of totalitarianism. Giving you are british you should be familiar enough to know that the use of the word in this way refers to the totalitarian aspect of it rather than the any actual alignment with the political views of the third reich.

How do you feel about people who pick up on minute errors in grammar yet make them themselves?

Quite relaxed really. If you hadn't been banging on about the death of proper english and how people need to use correct grammar I would never have picked you up on them in the first place. But you did so you shouldn't really be suprised that someone chose to pick you up on your own grammar.

Get the stick out of your own eye before you poke mine. You get your grammar right and maybe I'll listen more to your pointless ramblings, it's a shade more interesting than watching grass grow.

Col

Ahh more personal attacks. While I can understand why you find grammar nazi offensive it really wasn't included as a personal attack more a bit of hypocritical sensationalism on my part. Personally I don't feel the need to engage in personal attacks but if you feel you must please feel free to continue them.

 

[GaryPanic]

careful.. here

how many during WWII could not read/write- the number is scarey - probably around 1 in ten could not read/write to any level -
not too sure when comprehensive edumication (lol) came in ....

 

[Rich]

careful.. here

how many during WWII could not read/write- the number is scarey - probably around 1 in ten could not read/write to any level -
not too sure when comprehensive edumication (lol) came in ....

That may be so but they genuinely attempted to write correctly and given the size of paper they had to write on you wouldn't see the likes of "I c u soon" based on the excuse of the need for brevity