Are you an atheist?

Are you an atheist?


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My Bible reading is limited:D.....Genesis is enough. Although the Book of Job has an interesting part that could indicate God is referring to dinosaurs and not an elephant (or hippo) and crocodile, both of which are often mentioned in Bible footnotes but the descriptions don't match either.

One of the descriptions by God is a good match for a sauropod and the other is a good match for the large pre historic ocean type reptiles. This is quite interesting because the descriptions were wriiten well before dinosaurs and reptiles of the same period were discovered. The animal that meets the description of a sauropod is especially interesting because it is highly unlikely someone would dream up an animal like a sauropod.
It would be helpful if you can give Chapter and verse for these references. I Notice in Job 39:9 There is a reference to the unicorn which I am sure never existed so I am not sure I accept everything there as anything other than imaginative writing.
 
Just search on Job Dinosaur and there will be pages and pages. Then pick which one you want.

Also search on Leviathan and Behemoth as that will bring up info on translations etc. Again, pick which one you want to use:D

The Leviathan could match some pilosaurs and would suit Rich's "vivid imagination" answer. Also worth bearing in mind that flame breathing could be OK because of Bombardier beetle, electric eels and whatever else. The unicorn could easily be imagination because of the Oryx or Gemsbok.

But the Behemoth is tricky because of the tail like a cedar. A sauropod is about the only huge plant eating animal that has had a tail that is cedar like. Unlike the Leviathan and your unicorn there are no animals even remotely close except from the dinosaur end of town. The cedar tail excludes the elephant and hippo.
 
Something that is related which I find interesting is reference to dragons in the Bible and other ancient material.

Where did the inspiration come from to fuel imagination to arrive at a dragon. Perhaps the Nile crocodile? Snakes and lizards seem way too small. Perhaps it was snake because of Satan and Garden of Eden. But if you were totally unbiased then I think dinosaurs would be the inspiration for dragons.

From memory, the Bible only mentions are few specific animal types, one of which is the dragon.

For those not aware the standard answer with respect to age /fossils etc is God made them at that age. Adam and Eve for example are portrayed in the Bible as arriving as adults.
 
The very fact that history shows that humanity seeks to explain unknown phenomena by invoking 'God' is an interesting observation in itself. Why would we do that? It makes no sense to do so if it's just not true, does it? So why would humanity have evolved to blame some unknown being for the vagaries of real-world phenomena (apparently a false premise) when anyone who took a contrarion view should have learned more about the world that is true, and thereby benefitted from that learning and that attitude, and gained an evolutionary advantage. If it's not true, and a hindrance to learning truth about the world, surely natural and cultural selection would have eliminated it long ago?
A possible explanation for this is that in societies dominated by an elite gods are very useful to hide behind when for example natural disasters strike. To be able to blame the disaster on a supernatural punishment shifts the blame etc from the elite.

Humans always have a tendency to look for a scapegoat when misfortune occurs (look at the modern tendency to sue at the drop of a hat) and by diverting this from themselves the elite were able to survive any threatened mutiny.
 
No, my teapot is just a viable as your god.
IMHO neither are viable. I just do not accept the supernatural. Two hundred years ago radio and TV would have seemed miraculous. But now we know how they work.
 
Can you explain what you meant - in the original summing up? Regarding the N pole and B Bang?

Craig's point is that often the question you ask is already framed for an answer, just because you can ask a question, it doesn't mean it has a valid answer

my point is: there is nothing north of the North Pole, because north is a property that begins at the North Pole

in the same way, time began at the big bang, there was no before
 
A possible explanation for this is that in societies dominated by an elite gods are very useful to hide behind when for example natural disasters strike. To be able to blame the disaster on a supernatural punishment shifts the blame etc from the elite.

Humans always have a tendency to look for a scapegoat when misfortune occurs (look at the modern tendency to sue at the drop of a hat) and by diverting this from themselves the elite were able to survive any threatened mutiny.

i refer you to Skinner's pigeons

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superstition#Superstition_and_psychology

:D
 
Don't you find it strange that so many medical specialists are of the view....there is definitely something there...
Do you actually have any independent statistics to support this claim?
 
Just saw this on someones signature. "There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened." Douglas Adams
 
Adam and Eve for example are portrayed in the Bible as arriving as adults.

Which version are you using to back up that statement? As I recall Eve was created from the rib of Adam and even that is contentious in more than one way
 
Do you actually have any independent statistics to support this claim?

No, my own experience plus that of others in the insurance business. Atheism is also rare among GPs, dentists and solicitors. However, it is common with engineers and architects and very common among gov't employed (or large institution) academics.

The reason we know this is that just like many products, people who are most likely to by insurance to cover their income in the event of disability, death, total and permanent disability or if a trauma event (heart attack, cancer etc) occurs tend to have a certain profile. However, the profile of those who are very unlikely to buy is even stronger.

You will notice in the occupations I listed as examples all have good to very high education but the occupations are vastly different with the two groups. The non atheist occupations are not involved in calculations and the like. The very nature of their occupation is dealing with great variables and/or the variables of people's personalities.

Belief in a supernatural and especially at the Bible/God level is at its strongest when income is very high and formal education is low and in fact it would be this area where it is strongest, not just in numbers but strength of belief. It is at its lowest when income is low (when compared to high incomes, not average income) but formal education is high.
 
Which version are you using to back up that statement? As I recall Eve was created from the rib of Adam and even that is contentious in more than one way

But it was not many pages before they started begatting:D
 
The very fact that history shows that humanity seeks to explain unknown phenomena by invoking 'God' is an interesting observation in itself. Why would we do that?
It must have been some comfort to ancient people who had no idea of the actual causes of such things to think that earthquakes, diseases, etc. rather than being explainable occurrences were being caused by a being or beings of some kind. Once these beings have been thought up, the assumption is made that their motives are roughly the same as our own. Why? Probably because these people wouldn't have been able to conceive of someone with a thought process totally alien to their own (not that we necessarily can today). Once one accepts that someone much like oneself is causing these problems, one can try to suck up to them, to avoid future difficulties. This can be done via sacrifices, fasting, or whatever.
It makes no sense to do so if it's just not true, does it?
This religion can also be used to direct the behaviour of the populace.
Live in an area where it's hot and food goes bad quickly, so food poisoning is a great risk? Say that the gods have decreed that eating those foods particularly prone to carrying bacteria (e.g. shellfish) is 'bad'.
Trying to maintin some kind of order? Say that the being has handed out a list of things you're not supposed to do.
I'm sure there are many more examples of 'sensible' instructions supposedly given out by one or other of the gods.
So why would humanity have evolved to blame some unknown being for the vagaries of real-world phenomena (apparently a false premise) when anyone who took a contrarion view should have learned more about the world that is true, and thereby benefitted from that learning and that attitude, and gained an evolutionary advantage. If it's not true, and a hindrance to learning truth about the world, surely natural and cultural selection would have eliminated it long ago?
1) If you've never known that way of thinking to begin with, why would you search for knowledge? Far easier to accept what your parents and theirs before them have said. There's also an aspect of 'the king's new clothes' about it.
2) Throughout history there have been people who famously came out and said what turned out to be correct, but who were punished for it, as it went against the norm. If you had the foresight to realise that the earth revolved around the sun, and Torquemada asked you about it, there's a fair chance you'd keep your mouth shut about your ideas and just go with the church's line of thinking.
3) There have always been people who can use the fact that one or other of the gods *ahem* 'spoke to them' as justification to do whatever they wanted -whether it was taking lands from godless savages or just trying to get votes - knowing full well that they could then say that anyone who disagreed with them was disagreeing with god.
 
But it was not many pages before they started begatting:D
How? I know little of the bible, so I'm open to learning here, but I thought the thing was meant to start with Adam. He was used to create Eve. They then created Cain and Abel. Where did the wives come from?
 
How? I know little of the bible, so I'm open to learning here, but I thought the thing was meant to start with Adam. He was used to create Eve. They then created Cain and Abel. Where did the wives come from?


It was before women's lib so they did not score a mention:)
 
It was before women's lib so they did not score a mention:)
But the writers thought they'd mention potential dinosaurs? You'd think God would have known about the dangers of using ghost writers, as opposed to self-publishing.;)
 

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