Access 365 Runtime: Click and Run offline Installer (1 Viewer)

Babycat

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Hi Everyone.

Do you know where to get this offline installer?

I am distributing .accde file, but I am not sure if end-user has/dont have MSA, so I want them to install Access 365 runtime. Some of their PC dont have internet access.
So I wish I could send them offline installer file via USB thumdrive.

I found this link, but it seem quite complicated for me and my user too.


Btw: I have just realized the existing of extension accdr. Should I use accde or accdr to distribute my FE?

Thank you.
 

CJ_London

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Should I use accde or accdr to distribute my FE?
doesn't really matter, the .accdr extension is to enable a developer with a full version to test an app that will be run in a runtime environment. If you haven't already done that, you need to do so before distributing. Main features missing from runtime - navigation window, right click menus, error handling - any error will cause the app to close without warning and without any useful error message, and minimal ribbon options. If you need them, you will need to write your own equivalents. Ultimate user will still need a full or runtime version of access installed to run a .accdr

Not sure what you mean by MSA (Microsoft Access?) but a user cannot have a full version and a runtime version installed, they will get conflicts. They also need to have the same 'bit' (32 or 64) for a .accde for their version of access. And you need to ensure your .accde is the earliest version relevant to your users - they may have access 2013 installed for example, so your .accde needs to be 2013 or earlier.

You should be able to download the runtime install files to copy to a usb for them to install ms access runtime. I would investigate using an installer (I use Inno) to install everything so your user only needs to execute an install.exe file - subject to any IT restrictions that may be in place. The runtime files are quite large but should fit on a usb without any problem.
 

Babycat

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doesn't really matter, the .accdr extension is to enable a developer with a full version to test an app that will be run in a runtime environment. If you haven't already done that, you need to do so before distributing. Main features missing from runtime - navigation window, right click menus, error handling - any error will cause the app to close without warning and without any useful error message, and minimal ribbon options. If you need them, you will need to write your own equivalents. Ultimate user will still need a full or runtime version of access installed to run a .accdr

Not sure what you mean by MSA (Microsoft Access?) but a user cannot have a full version and a runtime version installed, they will get conflicts. They also need to have the same 'bit' (32 or 64) for a .accde for their version of access. And you need to ensure your .accde is the earliest version relevant to your users - they may have access 2013 installed for example, so your .accde needs to be 2013 or earlier.

You should be able to download the runtime install files to copy to a usb for them to install ms access runtime. I would investigate using an installer (I use Inno) to install everything so your user only needs to execute an install.exe file - subject to any IT restrictions that may be in place. The runtime files are quite large but should fit on a usb without any problem.
Thank CJ_London for your useful info.

I develop everything on my PC will full Access, thus I will go ahead with accde.
Yes, MSA means for Microsoft Access. What if my customer is already installed with full access version let says A2013/A2016 and I insist to install A365 runtime. Will A365 runtime overwrite A2013/A2016? I dont have chance to test this scenario yet.

I am using SSE Setup to build installer package, it is quite specific for Access distribution.

About downloading runtime install files, may you please give a try?

I download from
Download and install Microsoft 365 Access Runtime
but this installer still requires Internet connection for installing Access runtime.

1640307847120.png
 

CJ_London

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what if my customer is already installed with full access version let says A2013/A2016 and I insist to install A365 runtime. Will A365 runtime overwrite A2013/A2016? I dont have chance to test this scenario yet.
If they are different versions then I believe they can co exist side by side, but the user will have the inconvenience of having to specify which version of access they wish to use every time they open an access db. @isladogs knows quite a bit of this - hopefully he will see the flag I placed and will respond with a more complete answer.

With regards install, I have no experience of the 365 version. Clearly you need internet access to get the install files - however I don't know if by clicking download you will get an executable file you can pass on to your user or whether further internet access will be required as part of the install process to download more and/or for registration of the install. All I can suggest is try it and see. As mentioned before, the files are large (too large to email) and in my case, all clients have internet access so I just send them the link.

Suggest you find a spare computer and try it yourself
 

Babycat

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If they are different versions then I believe they can co exist side by side, but the user will have the inconvenience of having to specify which version of access they wish to use every time they open an access db. @isladogs knows quite a bit of this - hopefully he will see the flag I placed and will respond with a more complete answer.
Yeah, wait for him to confirm

With regards install, I have no experience of the 365 version. Clearly you need internet access to get the install files - however I don't know if by clicking download you will get an executable file you can pass on to your user or whether further internet access will be required as part of the install process to download more and/or for registration of the install. All I can suggest is try it and see. As mentioned before, the files are large (too large to email) and in my case, all clients have internet access so I just send them the link.

Suggest you find a spare computer and try it yourself
I already tried. With the link in my #3, i can only download the file with size of 7Mb. Thus, I believe it still need internet for downloading the true Access Runtime file.
 

CJ_London

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the file with size of 7Mb.
suggest try copying the download to and executing it on a spare computer without an internet connection - the file will/should contain what is required to install runtime - but whether it still needs an internet connection, I don't know
 

isladogs

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365 runtime will not overwrite an existing full version of 2013 & I'm almost certain it won't overwrite 2016 either
However I see no reason why any end user would ever want to have both of those at once.

I have been distributing Access files using installer packages for well over a decade.
I NEVER supply the Runtime version - partly to save on file size but also because clients can download it themselves if they need it.

If you choose to supply the runtime version, then ensure your installer package first checks whether Access is already installed
Then only install Runtime where no existing version exists.

I don't use SSE Setup but in previous lengthy discussion with Chris Long who is the developer for SSE it seems it has (or had) no scripting facility.
If so, it may not be able to handle that option.
However other installer packages such as SamLogic Visual Installer Pro which I use can easily do so
 

arnelgp

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its a NO.
either you have runtime or full version.
they will Overwrite each other.
 

isladogs

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its a NO.
either you have runtime or full version.
they will Overwrite each other.
Perhaps you've never tried but it is certainly possible to have both a runtime and full version of Access on the same machine, providing they aren't the same version. Similarly you can install two different full versions. I've had both 2010 & 365 on my main development machine for many years. You may find occasional re-configuration issues but those are easily avoided with care.

Taking it a stage further, in some cases you can actually have mixed bit-ness installations including two or more versions of Access providing the newest version is 64-bit and is installed first ...followed by an older 32-bit version. Whilst that goes against conventional advice about what can be done, I know it works from a series of tests I ran a few months ago. See Mike Wolfe's article where he references the results I published at UA some months ago.

The UA thread he referenced is:

Note that whilst you can do this, it doesn't mean that I'm recommending you should do so!
 
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Pat Hartman

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Should I use accde or accdr to distribute my FE?
I recommend accdr. WHY? Because if the user does have the full version of Access, he will not be able to get into design view on ANYTHING as long as he doesn't know he can rename the db.
When you open the .accde with the full version, you can still get into design view on tables, queries, and macros and that can cause a lot of damage, especially if you are not using a distribution method that downloads a fresh copy of the FE each time the user opens the app.
 

Babycat

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I recommend accdr. WHY? Because if the user does have the full version of Access, he will not be able to get into design view on ANYTHING as long as he doesn't know he can rename the db.
When you open the .accde with the full version, you can still get into design view on tables, queries, and macros and that can cause a lot of damage, especially if you are not using a distribution method that downloads a fresh copy of the FE each time the user opens the app.
Dear Pat

I actually lock shift_key and hide all menu/navigation panel. They are only accessible when logged in with Admin account.
Let me play around with accdr... Infact, I dont (dont know) distribute FE by copy the new FE each time db open. I am curious, if FE is downloaded from server to local machine everytime user open db, then how to implement features like remember me (on login form)?
 

isladogs

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I would recommend first converting to ACCDE then renaming as ACCDR ...which may be what Pat intended originally
 

Pat Hartman

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Converting to .accdr as the final step after creating the .accde is just one more hurdle for the user to get past. However, as CJ pointed out, NO Access FE or BE for that matter is actually secure. We lock the FE to prevent accidents more than anything else. In fact, for my own convenience, I distribute as .accdb renamed to .accdr. That ensures that the user has to go out of his way (and know the trick) to get into the FE. When they get access to the app, they are all informed that they are to use the interface provided and to never, ever try to break in to get around security. Doing so would be cause for dismissal. You are trusting your employees with the company's most precious asset - its data. You might as well trust them to not mess around. The .accdr prevents accidents but since NOTHING actually secures the FE, I don't bother for in house applications.

For applications I sell, I do all the things that are recommended because I am attempting to ensure my intellectual property. In this case, I have legal agreements but it still comes down to trust.

hen how to implement features like remember me (on login form)?
This is a security breach and most companies would frown on it. It is one thing to use it at home for your convenience where no one else has access to your PC, but in an office environment, I wouldn't do it. But, you can still do it if IT security doesn't care, you just need to use the Environ("UserName") to lookup who is logged in if you are not using that ID as the login already.
 

Pat Hartman

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If you want to use an installer package, you might try Visual Installer. It allows you to include the runtime engine.

I'm with Colin though. I don't like including the runtime for a lot of reasons. If your client doesn't have all their PCs connected to the internet, they can download to a CD or thumb drive and use that to do the install.
 

Babycat

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easily overcome by someone with a bit of access knowledge
Thank CJ, it seems I have got only 1/2 bit of access knowledge because I dont know how to bypass it.
I have disabled Access sepecial keys (Alt+F11), hide Toolbar with command:
Code:
DoCmd.Showtoolbar "Ribbon", acToolbarNo ' Hide main database window

The only weakness of FE accde I know, that is BE password can be easily extracted from FE accde when open by notepad. So my BE table can be unlocked and read manually.
 

Babycat

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Converting to .accdr as the final step after creating the .accde is just one more hurdle for the user to get past. However, as CJ pointed out, NO Access FE or BE for that matter is actually secure. We lock the FE to prevent accidents more than anything else. In fact, for my own convenience, I distribute as .accdb renamed to .accdr. That ensures that the user has to go out of his way (and know the trick) to get into the FE. When they get access to the app, they are all informed that they are to use the interface provided and to never, ever try to break in to get around security. Doing so would be cause for dismissal. You are trusting your employees with the company's most precious asset - its data. You might as well trust them to not mess around. The .accdr prevents accidents but since NOTHING actually secures the FE, I don't bother for in house applications.

For applications I sell, I do all the things that are recommended because I am attempting to ensure my intellectual property. In this case, I have legal agreements but it still comes down to trust.


This is a security breach and most companies would frown on it. It is one thing to use it at home for your convenience where no one else has access to your PC, but in an office environment, I wouldn't do it. But, you can still do it if IT security doesn't care, you just need to use the Environ("UserName") to lookup who is logged in if you are not using that ID as the login already.
Dear Pat.

I hope i got your all meaning with my poor english.
If you simply rename your FE from accdb to accdr, what if someone renames back from accdr to accdb? They got access to everything even VBA code too?

I am not sure about "accidents" you mentioned.
But just 2 weeks ago, my customer got critical issue with accde. I splited db, and send FE accde shortcut to desktop, this FE does not have any local table. The BE was design with attachment field for product photo. At that time BE file size was about 50Mb.
When i opened customer PC, the desktop shortcut gone, project_BE.accdb gone too. In the installed folder, the projectname.accde is changed name to projectname.mdb. Thus, they lost all data from previous backup.
If it is a kind of "accidents" which you mentioned, can I avoild it with accdr?

My customer data are very sensitive, that why they dont want internet connection to that PC to prevent any potential of hacking.
 

isladogs

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Thank CJ, it seems I have got only 1/2 bit of access knowledge because I dont know how to bypass it.
I have disabled Access sepecial keys (Alt+F11), hide Toolbar with command:
Code:
DoCmd.Showtoolbar "Ribbon", acToolbarNo ' Hide main database window

The only weakness of FE accde I know, that is BE password can be easily extracted from FE accde when open by notepad. So my BE table can be unlocked and read manually.
If you encrypt your FE with a password, the BE password cannot be read in Notepad as the entire file has 128-bit encryption
See Compare Access File Security - Mendip Data Systems (isladogs.co.uk)

As CJ-L stated, experienced Access developers can undo all security measures including shift bypass etc. They can also remove a password (assuming they know it). You can never make an Access database 100% secure....but you can make it difficult enough to deter all butthe most determined hackers
 

Pat Hartman

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If you simply rename your FE from accdb to accdr, what if someone renames back from accdr to accdb? They got access to everything even VBA code too?
As I said, this was for MY convenience for an internal application. Most applications are internal. I.e. written by and for the same company. That means that the intellectual property is not yours anyway. It belongs to the company that hired you to do the work. Renaming the FE is just a trick but it keeps people from accidentally getting into design view should they open the FE using the full version of Access. Access is not at all secure, no matter what you do. Therefore, you need to do what you can to prevent accidents. But, sabotage or theft is a whole different matter.

Nothing you can do is going to protect you from the catastrophe you described. Normally Access developers are not responsible for network security or backups or things like that. You just develop the application and other, more specialized people take care of the environment. If you find yourself in a situation where you do not have people to secure the environment, then at least some of the burden will fall on you because YOU are the person who knows the danger. Therefore, YOU need to ensure that backups are automated and at sufficiently frequently intervals to ensure the minimum data loss. Do not leave this to chance.

Insist that the company/client purchase software and then set it up for them. FMSInc.com sells useful software for Access applications. Explain the problem and the liability. Backups are like an insurance policy. They are a price to pay so you can start over from a rational place should there be a loss. So, you need to ensure the backups run as scheduled. You need to ensure that a sufficient number of images are kept. Eight dailies and 13 monthlies are a bare minimum. You should probably have several annual backups also. AND all backups need to be backed up off site. I use Carbonite for this. It backs up my home computer. Every time a file is saved, it is backed up within a few hours as Carbonite works in the background. Then you have to do some trial runs to make sure you can get to your local and remote backups and restore from them. The reason for having so many is because occasionally a user will delete something and realize later that it was a mistake.
You will then have to search through the backups until you find the last saved version of the data so you can restore it. You wouldn't restore the entire table or database, just a record or two so it is a completely manual process. Or even worse, you might find corruption and have to go back more than one backup to get past it.

Then there are a couple of techniques you can use with how you name directories that will keep people from accidently browsing to your important files - like the BE and the master copy of the FE so that they can't be accidentally deleted. The files can also be secured so that only certain people have the proper credentials to actually delete them.

The distribution method I use distributes a fresh copy of the FE each time the user clicks on his shortcut. We can discuss that separately if you start a new thread.

For my own personal Access work, I include automatic backups in all my FE's. They are hardcoded with my userID. So if I am the one who opened the app and some object was changed, they ask when the db closes if I want to make a backup. I make two types. One is just a copy of the FE .accdb and the other is an export to text of all objects EXCEPT tables. I allow these to accumulate and clean them out every month or so but back ups of major version releases longer. Think of these as "monthlies' or "yearly's".
 
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