Green Energy is a giant crock of sh...

[Rich]

It was a Haynes' manual that was my bible that kept my 105E Anglia (think Harry Potter) on the road as a young man.

Brian

Sawdust in the back axle diff kept mine going

 

[Brianwarnock]

Sawdust in the back axle diff kept mine going

page 46?

brian

 

[PNGBill]

Those were the days when you could work on your car with out the need to have $20,000 spent on tools and equipment and two science degrees and it be push started and if the cigarette lighter failed you didn't have to call the auto association because the on board computer shut everything down !

Sorry - off subject - but on the Volvo uk forum there was a lot of postings about the cash for scrapage in the UK and later in US. All the cars the forum members looked forward to buying at a reasonable price suddenly became landfill for $1,000 not very "green"

no problems here in PNG. You just keep driving your car until it has really fallen to bits (often all over the road) and then just leave it on the road side to oxidize over the next few years.

 

[Rich]

I think you'll find that most, or a large part, of the supposedly scrapped cars found their way to Eastern Europe

 

[PNGBill]

Right hand drive ?

 

[Rich]

Why not, enough of their lorries come here with l/h drive

 

[John Big Booty]

.......

Religious belief by definition is doctine and inevitably stifles the potential for extending the sophistication of our moral sensibilities. This in itself is philosophically corrupt.

........

Religious belief per se is not the problem. The problem is a strong and unbending belief (intolerance) that Ones own belief is correct and that, that belief must be imposed on others. This is more a symptom of man's hubris rather that the fault of the religious system he professes to follow.

Whilst it is true that religion has been used as a justification for all manner of evil, you need look no further than communist Russian or China, to see examples of the depths to which an atheist society can sink. You will also note that this approach has had little effect on the religious beliefs of the people in either of these countries.

As you rail against religion, do not forget that it has also been the source of great good. Do not allow your own hubris to extinguish your tolerance for beliefs that do not sit neatly beside your own.

 

[Galaxiom]

Religious belief IS the problem. Religion is by definition a strong and unbending belief, an unquestioned faith, that persists even in spite of evidence against it. It holds our intellect to ransom.

Apologists inevitably blame human nature or "man's hubris" as though dogma is inevitable. Dogma is not inevitable but persists because it is not countered under the terms of "respect for religious beliefs".

Apologists also like to roll out the examples of atheist crimes against humanity. These regimes were based on religious beliefs (strongly held unquestioned faith). Though they were not belief in heavenly deities they treated their leaders as terrestrial gods and refused to allow criticism.

They failed in their repression of religion because they substituted one form of fascist belief for another and adopted exactly the same methods of repression long used by the church whenever they had the upper hand.

Religion has not been the source of great good. The good came from the people. These people are good not because of their religion but in spite of it.

My position is not hubris. Such embodied arrogance is the forte of the church. I deny they have the right to propogate their beliefs without question. Their beliefs do not deserve our silent respect any more than any other belief system. Yet churches demand this of us while openly and unapologetically criticising secular belief at every opportunity. It is blatant hypocrisy and those who apologise for religion are part of the problem.

Fascism does not sit neatly against my beliefs. Should I learn to tolerate neo-Nazis too?

 

[PNGBill]

What a shame such a good thread has got so far off track.

 

[John Big Booty]

..,.......

Fascism does not sit neatly against my beliefs. Should I learn to tolerate neo-Nazis too?

Congratulations on Godwin-ing the thread.

 

[Galaxiom]

Congratulations on Godwin-ing the thread.

From the same article:

However, Godwin's law itself can be abused, as a distraction, diversion or even censorship, that fallaciously miscasts an opponent's argument as hyperbole, especially if the comparisons made by the argument are actually appropriate. A 2005 Reason magazine article argued that Godwin's law is often misused to ridicule even valid comparisons.


My comparisons between religion and fascism are wholely appropriate.

 

[Alc]

My comparisons between religion and fascism are wholely appropriate.

...and wholly inappropriate for this thread. The word 'bible' (with or without a capital B) was used in a perfectly harmless sense and was understood as such by, apparently, everyone except yourself. If you want to bang on about the dangers of religion, more power to you. Please, just do it on one of the many, many threads where this debate is already happening and leave this one to get back to the topic being discussed. It's rare enough that an interesting thread starts around here and doesn't slip into religion, US-bashing, motorbikes, or various members saying what good musicians they are.

 

[ColinEssex]

It's rare enough that an interesting thread starts around here and doesn't slip into religion, US-bashing, motorbikes, or various members saying what good musicians they are.

Religion is the biggest killer and war starter of all time and deserves discussion, the US is the biggest arrogant, hypocritical country and deserves a bashing, (a bit like one or two US members here) motorbikes are an excellent form of transport favoured here by many, also, many members here are musicians and enjoy discussing it.

Col

 

[Alc]

Religion is the biggest killer and war starter of all time and deserves discussion, the US is the biggest arrogant, hypocritical country and deserves a bashing, (a bit like one or two US members here) motorbikes are an excellent form of transport favoured here by many, also, many members here are musicians and enjoy discussing it.

Col

Many members are tedious boors, you're quite right.
Doesn't give you, sorry, them the right to deliberately sideline threads with irrelevant posts.

Want to talk bikes? Do it on a bike thread.
Music? Likewise.
Religion? Ditto.
See where this is going?

 

[Rich]

Many members are tedious boors, you're quite right.
Doesn't give you, sorry, them the right to deliberately sideline threads with irrelevant posts.

Want to talk bikes? Do it on a bike thread.
Music? Likewise.
Religion? Ditto.
See where this is going?

What's a boor?

 

[Alc]

What's a boor?

I assume you're being facetious and implying that I meant to type 'bore', since I know from your other posts that you're far from ignorant on the English language.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/boors
I was using the first definition, since I feel that anyone who repeatedly sidetracks a discussion on any subject is a distinct lack of manners.

 

[Galaxiom]

I do feel that religion is relevant to this thread about attitudes to our energy future.

While I don't have hard statistics, casual observation suggests a significant connection between being religious and being a climate change denier.

I have actually seen it argued that the Holy Bible does not include prophecies of any problems regarding climate therefore it isn't happening.

Religionists reject science as part of the denial of evolution and carry this attitude over to climate science.

Others see climate change as part of the fulfilment of the Armageddon prhopecies. Their excitement as they see the coming of "the end days" is palpable.

 

[PNGBill]

As many points of view as anyone wishes can be posted as to whether or not religion belongs in this thread but it is a fact that since it came up, not one post has touched on any solutions, working or otherwise, to harness energy without effecting climate change - maybe this wasn't the original discussion but I think most link Climate Change and the need for Energy together and now we have religion as well.

 

[John Big Booty]

I do feel that religion is relevant to this thread about attitudes to our energy future.

While I don't have hard statistics, casual observation suggests a significant connection between being religious and being a climate change denier.

I have actually seen it argued that the Holy Bible does not include prophecies of any problems regarding climate therefore it isn't happening.

Religionists reject science as part of the denial of evolution and carry this attitude over to climate science.

Others see climate change as part of the fulfilment of the Armageddon prhopecies. Their excitement as they see the coming of "the end days" is palpable.

You have gone after the use of the word "Bible" (clearly used to mean a manual) with a religious zeal worthy of any Jihadi. So what does that say about your own state of mind? That you have blown the use of this word into a one man crusade against any beliefs, that fail to fit within your own world view.

 

[Galaxiom]

You have gone after the use of the word "Bible" (clearly used to mean a manual) with a religious zeal worthy of any Jihadi.

Then I suggest people use the word "manual".

Jihadists use violence and repression to force their values on society. I simply express my views and leave others to make their choices. The religious apologists who denigrate my right to express my displeasure with religious indoctrination are far closer to the Jihadist mentality. Religion relys the misguided notion that it is politically incorrect for others to speak out against these beliefs.

So what does that say about your own state of mind? That you have blown the use of this word into a one man crusade against any beliefs, that fail to fit within your own world view.

My state of mind is one of disgust with the lack of awareness of what the insidious malignancy of religion is doing to our planet.

I woulnd't term it a crusade. I reserve that term for the Christian zealots who inflicted their hubris upon the people of the Middle East because they believed they had greater rights to control the "holy" city of Jerusalem.