Pat Hartman has left the building (4 Viewers)

[BlueSpruce]

Sorry, but I don't quite understand this expression
What does "..pass the biscuits.." mean?

A biscuit is a prize sarcastically awarded for shocking behaviour, but in the context @Isaac used it, was more like "Okay, I got these feelings off my chest, nuff said, lets move on..." ?

Overall, Pat did cause a certain amount of friction with her style of critiquing databases. And I found her approach to topics like VBA and SQL Server to be very interesting, as if cloaking a certain lack of knowledge with a fake veneer of despising. Sorry, but that is the truth I can finally get it out. On the plus side, she was very pleasant to chat with at other times, told interesting stories and did have a lot of knowledge about table design, reports and forms, which I admired. (See, I am saying the nice stuff too, so don't jump on me). She had a lot of knowledge about getting business requirements and turning them into databases, which I admired and she freely (if bruskly) shared. Her passion about politics was destined to lead her to this point, and I for one believe this was part of the momentum which lead up to her leaving: She began to realize that an increasing number of people, even former T. supporters, were "souring" on him, his administrations' actions, and Israel's actions. That angered her, as if numbers of people were leaving the 'fold' of the faithful. I happened to be among those people, and I could sense her increasing frustration that people once devoted to supporting T were now criticizing him. I won't even say his name here, as I don't want people to think I am turning THIS into a political post. I'm not - I'm just saying she was frustrated to literally watch his support decreasing more, more, and more. This upset and disappointed her, and I can understand that . It's as if you have a crowd of people supporting and cheering for someone, and you begin to watch the crowd slowly disperse to nearly nothing......It frustrated her to no end, so I feel I was part of it too. But I think I did and said the right things, meaning my own convictions I stayed true to.
Amen. Pass the biscuits.

I can't imagine how she felt when J.B. became President.

 

[Uncle Gizmo]

I can't imagine how she felt when J.B. became President

Jeff Bezos? Ah, so the White House is powered by Prime delivery and drone strikes on bad reviews?

 

[Jon]

I kind of miss debating with Pat, but we must keep AWF safe from the thought police.

And keep members safe too. There have been about 12,000 arrests in the UK during 2023 for breaking electronic communications laws, although they haven't broken it down into a number for social media posts.

 

[BlueSpruce]

And keep members safe too. There have been about 12,000 arrests in the UK during 2023 for breaking electronic communications laws, although they haven't broken it down into a number for social media posts.

Yes, including members. I would think if the UK were to issue international arrest warrants for violating OSA, it would be unenforceable and declared unconstitutional by foreign countries, unless they decide to cooperate with the UK.

Looks like freedom of speech and democracy is no more in the UK. I hope the same does not happen in the USA and other democracies.

 

[Isaac]

Sorry, but I don't quite understand this expression
What does "..pass the biscuits.." mean?

It's just humor. And meaningless humor at that. Basically means "Okay, I'm done", and it also kind of makes fun of myself for sounding so official, as if it were an offered prayer.

 

[NauticalGent]

...as if it were an offered prayer.

You never miss an opportunity to introduce religion, doya?!?

 

[BlueSpruce]

You never miss an opportunity to introduce religion, doya?!?

The age ole controversy that continues to create turmoil in this world. Whatever happened to the "I'm ok, you're ok" philosophy? Thank goodness we don't live in the Spanish Inquisition era. Those were rough times.

 

[Isaac]

You never miss an opportunity to introduce religion, doya?!?

Oh please! (dont worry i know you're just teasing).
No, I suppose I don't lol

 

[raziel3]

And keep members safe too. There have been about 12,000 arrests in the UK during 2023 for breaking electronic communications laws, although they haven't broken it down into a number for social media posts.

I'm not familiar with the dos and don'ts of this law, I'm not from there. Can you give an example what exactly was broken (social media/internet related)?

 

[Thales750]

Seems a little bit like a book burning. A very sad day for all the people coming after us who want to learn how to build databases.
The person would have to be feeling really, I don't know, depressed to wantonly destroy an entire lifetime's work of evidence of their own value.
I may have been one of her most ardent dissenters, and probably the recipient of the bulk of her caustic diatribes.
And yet, I feel this is a great loss to have that much knowledge erased. I for one did not want this to end this way, I continuously held out hope that she would learn how to temper her responses, and even acknowledge the possibility that a single worldview is in no one's best interest, especially their own.
Pat, if you're reading this, for whatever part I may have played in this decision to eradicate all of that incredible body of knowledge, then I apologize. Although, I imagine if you are reading this you are probably thinking that I'm nowhere near important enough to have any influence on you, as it should be.

 

[BlueSpruce]

Seems a little bit like a book burning. A very sad day for all the people coming after us who want to learn how to build databases.
The person would have to be feeling really, I don't know, depressed to wantonly destroy an entire lifetime's work of evidence of their own value.
I may have been one of her most ardent dissenters, and probably the recipient of the bulk of her caustic diatribes.
And yet, I feel this is a great loss to have that much knowledge erased. I for one did not want this to end this way, I continuously held out hope that she would learn how to temper her responses, and even acknowledge the possibility that a single worldview is in no one's best interest, especially their own.
Pat, if you're reading this, for whatever part I may have played in this decision to eradicate all of that incredible body of knowledge, then I apologize. Although, I imagine if you are reading this you are probably thinking that I'm nowhere near important enough to have any influence on you, as it should be.

Don't beat yourself up, it was bound to happen with or without you. Life goes on.

 

[Isaac]

And while I respect Pat in certain areas, and in those certain areas quite highly, yet I will not be afraid to say it was an absolutely terrible and petty decision for her to demand that all of her posts be deleted. That's just childish and Jon didn't have to comply with it but he did so probably out of just not wanting to deal with retribution and whatever additional pettiness may have followed a refusal

 

[BlueSpruce]

And while I respect Pat in certain areas, and in those certain areas quite highly, yet I will not be afraid to say it was an absolutely terrible and petty decision for her to demand that all of her posts be deleted. That's just childish and Jon didn't have to comply with it but he did so probably out of just not wanting to deal with retribution and whatever additional pettiness may have followed a refusal

If that's what it took to end the chaos, then so be it. Thankfully, there are other great technical posts we can reference and now we have gurus, like @Albert D. Kallal returning to contribute. Perhaps others will follow now that there's calm after the storm.

 

[AccessBlaster]

It may be petty but she was the author the creator of what she wrote.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Can you give an example what exactly was broken (social media/internet related)?

I will try to make this a factual summary.

In the Politics & Current Events section, a couple of threads got out of control discussing the Israel/Hamas situation, which is a strongly polarizing subject. Those two threads in P&CE got to the point that indirect insults were exchanged via inference and implication. Formal reports were filed using the site's Report feature. The site's Terms and Rules (see bottom line for link) were being stretched if not actually broken.

After the two threads got REALLY harsh, I posted notices asking for folks to calm things down. In consultation with Jon, I locked the two threads. However, Jon got a notice that someone had complained about something in one of the threads based on the new UK Online Safety Act. Such complaints must be addressed quickly as they can lead to fines and penalties that would wreck the forums. Jon removed the entire Politics & Current Events forum and notified us that it had become a sore spot.

Shortly after that, Pat posted in a thread in the Watercooler section and brought up the Israel/Hamas topic. I censored the thread - including Pat's post - with a reminder that it had become a toxic topic that was unsafe for the forum. Shortly thereafter, Pat chose to remove herself from the site and asked Jon to delete her posts - all 78,000 of them. Which he did.

That pretty much covers the "what happened" and some of the "why." It was Pat's decision to depart and take her posts with her. I think we would all prefer to leave the rest of this unpleasant situation behind us.