Pay your bills (2 Viewers)

[Pat Hartman]

I was referring to the fact that you say things with a 100% bias, 100% of the time.

That is your opinion and you are entitled to it. What part of my remark in #165 prompted the name calling? Did John McCain not vote to overturn ObamaCare every time the bill came up for a vote EXCEPT for once the republicans had Congress and the Presidency so the vote mattered? When the vote came up while Trump was President, ObamaCare would have been overturned except that McCain had a raging hatred of Trump because Trump offended McCain because of a tasteless remark Trump made about McCain's stint as a POW. So to screw Trump, McCain screwed us all instead by voting No. Some "hero". Trump was right about him.

Generally when someone states facts, you don't call them names except of course if you don't believe the facts. I did offer an opinion on McCain to go along with the facts though. Maybe that was what you objected to.

 

[Thales750]

Just to add, what was slightly right of centre 20 years ago is considered ultra right wing extremist by todays left. I like Elon Musks meme of this concept.

The major flaws in this diagram is that number one it is purely fictional, or at least one person's opinion.
What is not an opinion, you can look this up.
If you leave that fiction part alone for a second, then you can focus on the number of people in the "fringes". You will find that there is a much larger percentage of right wing extremist than there are left. The far left could, and may, be further from the center, but there are so many less of them. They pose a much less danger to fabric of our society.

You are seeing the results of the far right now.

The agenda of the right is to instill fear and loathing. If pat takes me up on my offer of making a list of her statements, it should become clear, the mind set of the far right.

 

[Thales750]

That is your opinion and you are entitled to it. What part of my remark in #165 prompted the name calling? Did John McCain not vote to overturn ObamaCare every time the bill came up for a vote EXCEPT for once the republicans had Congress and the Presidency so the vote mattered? When the vote came up while Trump was President, ObamaCare would have been overturned except that McCain had a raging hatred of Trump because Trump offended McCain because of a tasteless remark Trump made about McCain's stint as a POW. So to screw Trump, McCain screwed us all instead by voting No. Some "hero". Trump was right about him.

That is not opinion. Would you like me to make a list of your unequivocal statements?
As far as the ACA, millions of people that were previously denied coverage are now covered.

 

[Thales750]

Let's not mention global Covid lockdowns, shall we?

If the economy is bad when Biden is in power, it is external problems causing it. If it is during Trumps reign, it was Trump causing it. If the economy does well when Obama is in power, it is due to Obama. If it does well when Trump is in power, it was because of external factors brought by the previous administration. All bad things are due to Trump, all good things are due to external factors.

That is not what I am saying. But here are to facts.
Obama inherited as crises equal to the great depression. The global economy lost $50 trillion right before he took office
Trump took office during the huge (8 year) sustained growth period.
during the Clinton Administration the Federal budget was balanced and we had another long period of financial health.

Are you asking me to prove a point? Because I have, the economy is not in the shambles that conservative are trying to have us believe. What is in shamble is conservative confidence. Hence all the noise of gloom and doom.

And yes, Covid was the catalyst that lead to inflation. But that is a very complicated scenario, with multiple root causes. I would be happy to have a conversation about it.

 

[Jon]

The major flaws in this diagram is that number one it is purely fictional, or at least one person's opinion.

A persons opinion isn't a flaw or fiction because you disagree with it. In fact, your own statement is itself a contradiction. Your opinion is that it is fictional, but you yourself say the flaw can be because it is a person opinion. So is your opinion also not a flaw, because it is an opinion? Think about that for a while.

We can't leave any fiction part alone for a second, because I do not see any fiction. The only fiction is your claim it is fiction, IMHO.

You will find that there is a much larger percentage of right wing extremist than there are left.

And this is precisely what the diagram is showing. The left has gone so far left, that all right wingers are now perceived as extremists. And this is corroborated exactly by your very own statements. I think, respectly, this meme might have flown over your head.

The agenda of the right is to instill fear and loathing.

You mean like...

- "There will be a bloodbath." - CNN reporters claiming violent rhetoric by Trump, with bloodshed. (Don't mention its about the auto industry)
- "Half of Trump supporters are deplorables." - Hilary Clinton
- Trump is a threat to world peace. Ignore the lack of wars.
- Trump is colluding with Putin, so to protect citizens we will launch investegations for years using a team of 95% angry Democrat lawyers.
- Trump incites an insurrection. Don't mention him asking to protest peacefully.
= Trump is a thread to democracy, so we must imprison him ASAP, just like our comrades in Russia and China.

 

[Jon]

That is not what I am saying. But here are to facts.

It is what you are implying when you state Trump left the economy in a shambles. You want to ignore the external factors, like Covid, that caused a huge economic downturn at the end of his reign, while bragging about how well Obama and Clinton did. If you weren't blaming Trump, you would say Covid left the economy in a shambles. Your comments were causal.

 

[Jon]

Side note: I hope everybody has a good easter, both the Left and the Right!

 

[Pat Hartman]

As far as the ACA, millions of people that were previously denied coverage are now covered.

You need to actually look at the statistics rather than listen to the talking heads. My insurance cost went from $6 thousand per year to $12 thousand for my husband and myself. PLUS I lost my doctor!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! My daughter's only went to $8000 for her and the twins but she had a $5000 deductible on top of that. It is quite likely that yours also went up but perhaps not by so much.

The ONLY folks who benefited from ObamaCare were the insurance companies. Check the stock prices. Yes, some previously uncovered people got "coverage".

ObamaCare was a typical "feel good" bill that was based on a lie. It was thousands of pages long and dropped so close to the vote that no one actually read it before they voted.

The "lie" is the actual cost of covering the uninsured. I'll give you an example. Hospitals set their prices for each service down to the aspirin they give you which is billed at $5 for two pills. The paper slippers are $10. A CAT scan is billed at $5000 plus another $1500 for a doctor in India to read the scan remotely. Insurance companies negotiate prices with the hospitals. NO ONE EVER pays the posted rate UNLESS they happen to be uninsured. You can get a CAT scan at an imaging center for $350 but that hospital will take you to court to get $5000 for the one they did for your car accident.

I had an accident just before ObamaCare came in so I was very aware of the hospital pricing scam. In total, they billed my insurance company $27,000, the ambulance was $1900 but that was not on the hospital bill. When they took me into the emergency room on a gurney bleeding profusely from the head wound, the first thing they asked was "are you insured?". I said yes so they sent for a plastic surgeon so the hack on duty didn't have to stitch up my forehead. My insurance company paid $3600 to the hospital and the hospital accepted that as payment in full. Then they logged up a loss of $23, 400. That is the lie. They didn't lose any money. They got paid the negotiated prices for the services they rendered.

 

[moke123]

The ONLY folks who benefited from ObamaCare were the insurance companies.

My daughter would disagree with that one. She pays $35 a month with vision and dental included.

Must be the deep state out to get republicans.

 

[Pat Hartman]

My daughter would disagree with that one. She pays $35 a month with vision and dental included.

Isn't she lucky. At least someone in your family is sucking off the teat of our welfare system. At least all the money isn't going to house illegal aliens and provide them with walking around money and free flights to get the hookers to the johns.

Shortly after ObamaCare, my husband and I finally qualified for Medicare so my cost (for just me) is now back down to $7000 per year -- no dental. No vision.

 

[moke123]

Your empathy for other people is breathtaking.

 

[ColinEssex]

Isn't she lucky. At least someone in your family is sucking off the teat of our welfare system. At least all the money isn't going to house illegal aliens and provide them with walking around money and free flights to get the hookers to the johns.

I don't understand what you mean. Free fights? To where? What's 'the johns'? I understand you call prostitutes 'hookers'.
Col

 

[Pat Hartman]

Your empathy for other people is breathtaking.

You know, I probably would have a great deal of empathy for her. I contribute regularly to local charities that help poor people. I also contribute to other types of charities. But, here's the rub. When I choose to give my money and time (I also develop software for local charities), it is CHARITY. It is me CHOOSING to give of my money and my time. When the government takes money from me at gunpoint and gives it to someone they deem to be more worthy, it is THEFT. Plain and simple.

I'm glad your daughter has healthcare. We could take better care of all the poor if we didn't do it so stupidly that we waste most of the money. I'm not glad that MY daughter and grandchildren think twice about whether they actually need to go to the doctor's because they essentially have NO insurance despite spending $8,000 per year because they have no coverage until they meet their $5,000 deductible. Perhaps, you'd like to contribute to my daughter's huge deductible. I'm contributing to yours.

 

[Thales750]

Trump incites an insurrection. Don't mention him asking to protest peacefully.

I watched the whole thing unfold. He was willing to sacrifice the life of the Vise president.
Any non sociopath would have been on the air waves telling them to stand down.

You know, I probably would have a great deal of empathy for her. I contribute regularly to local charities that help poor people. I also contribute to other types of charities. But, here's the rub. When I choose to give my money and time (I also develop software for local charities), it is CHARITY. It is me CHOOSING to give of my money and my time. When the government takes money from me at gunpoint and gives it to someone they deem to be more worthy, it is THEFT. Plain and simple.

I'm glad your daughter has healthcare. We could take better care of all the poor if we didn't do it so stupidly that we waste most of the money. I'm not glad that MY daughter and grandchildren think twice about whether they actually need to go to the doctor's because they essentially have NO insurance despite spending $8,000 per year because they have no coverage until they meet their $5,000 deductible. Perhaps, you'd like to contribute to my daughter's huge deductible. I'm contributing to yours.

Universal Health Care would solve all that. Your guy never had a replacement plan, he just wanted to destroy it because the Obama's folks created it.

 

[Thales750]

Side note: I hope everybody has a good easter, both the Left and the Right!

You too Jon. 35 years of sobriety has taught me to be thankful. Which means blessed from certain point of view.

 

[Pat Hartman]

I don't understand what you mean. Free fights? To where? What's 'the johns'? I understand you call prostitutes 'hookers'.

Sorry, if you aren't watching the news closely, you don't see all the stories.

In the US (and probably the UK as well), you CANNOT board an airplane without showing a valid photo ID. However, none of the illegal aliens possess valid photo IDs so they are given "papers" that allow them to board any airplane, apparently without a ticket either. It was reported that illegal alien prostitutes in Florida were using these papers to board planes and fly to their appointments. The airlines just bill the government for the flight.

Biden's administration is running the biggest human trafficking operation the world has ever seen. Unaccompanied minors with addresses pinned to their clothing are simply "delivered" to the addressee and no one ever checks to determine that they are being delivered to family rather than a child sex ring. Not only are the borders open to anyone who shows up, we are actually sending planes to other countries to pick people up so they don't have to go to the bother of getting themselves to Mexico and paying the drug cartels thousands of dollars to help them to cross the Rio Grande. So on top of the 9 million + who just walked in, we gave at least 300,000 the red carpet treatment and went to pick them up.

 

[Isaac]

They are making his worshipers even more fanatic.

You mean that majority of the nation that you so despise?

 

[Isaac]

The major flaws in this diagram is that number one it is purely fictional

Not really, it is strongly suggested from the fact that the Democrats are hemoragghing demographic blocks left and right. It is very unlikely that society has become more fanatical, it is likely that certain elements of the party have, this is why few people are planning to vote Democrat in the next election.

 

[Thales750]

You mean that majority of the nation that you so despise?

60 million is not a majority. Well it is a majority, but it is not the majority.

I don't despise them. I am concerned about the level of fanaticism they exabit, and their inability to discern the falsehood and contempt in their messaging.

I am as far from the left as i am from the right. Depending on a person's fanatic scale they will see me as someone, as you put it, " A majority that I despise." Rarely do fanatics from either side see me as a moderate.

 

[Thales750]

Not really, it is strongly suggested from the fact that the Democrats are hemoragghing demographic blocks left and right. It is very unlikely that society has become more fanatical, it is likely that certain elements of the party have, this is why few people are planning to vote Democrat in the next election.

I think that it is an indicator of the fixes that we need to implement in our nation; when the main argument seems to be that "your guy" is worse than mine.

The root cause of this problem is obvious.

Brain washing all around, from all sides, and it is so effective we just all collectively spent hours right on this very thread writing about it. Database developers are among the highest echelons of intelligence in our society. And yet, here we are. From my point of view. you are probably not really interested in my ideas on that subject

Think about that.