TRUMP and Project 2025 (1 Viewer)

[Pat Hartman]

To me the particularly hateful aspect of current anti-abortion laws is that you can't even grant the woman the option to terminate a pregnancy caused by the RA-word (which gets blanked out by forum filters).

I have no idea who you are talking to. But you have sure bought into the progressives' position.

But you CAN always get rid of the fetus. Does the woman know she was raped? Yes. Is there any part of her being that says she wants the child? No. If she reported the incident and sought medical help, chances are that unless she went to a Catholic hospital (and possibly even then) she was offered a morning after pill at that time. OR she could have gone to her doctor and requested it. WHY WAIT until it is too late to terminate the pregnancy before taking action? I don't know the laws in all 50 states. I know that some are very restrictive. If you were ra*** and your state prevents you from getting a morning after pill, get in the car and cross into a neighboring state and get a damn pill!!!!!!!!!!! If you take the pill the morning after, the success rate is very high and it is painless. Then work to change the law. The pills do work later to cause an actual miscarriage but I'm not sure how far into gestation they work and of course the longer you wait the more like an abortion the effects are.

Even I would almost certainly take immediate action for exactly the reasons you mentioned.

 

[Thales750]

I'm not against all regulation. I'm just against a lot of it.

Like the ones that protect our enviroment and make our houses safer?

 

[The_Doc_Man]

I have no idea who you are talking to. But you have sure bought into the progressives' position.

But you CAN always get rid of the fetus. Does the woman know she was raped? Yes. Is there any part of her being that says she wants the child? No. If she reported the incident and sought medical help, chances are that unless she went to a Catholic hospital (and possibly even then) she was offered a morning after pill at that time. OR she could have gone to her doctor and requested it. WHY WAIT until it is too late to terminate the pregnancy before taking action? I don't know the laws in all 50 states. I know that some are very restrictive. If you were ra*** and your state prevents you from getting a morning after pill, get in the car and cross into a neighboring state and get a damn pill!!!!!!!!!!! If you take the pill the morning after, the success rate is very high and it is painless. Then work to change the law. The pills do work later to cause an actual miscarriage but I'm not sure how far into gestation they work and of course the longer you wait the more like an abortion the effects are.

Even I would almost certainly take immediate action for exactly the reasons you mentioned.

Sorry, Pat... my response was to Mike Krallo's #11 post that included a statement about abortion being in contention. Should have made it a formal reply instead of an informal one.

Pat, I hope you don't suddenly think I've bought into a progressive position. In this subject I have been consistent for many years. I happen to think I've bought into the idea that we have too many laws that restrict women's options, too many laws that sound too much like Sharia (Islamic) mandates... which I oppose most strenuously. And name-calling (by saying I've bought into a progressive's position) doesn't become you.

There was a recent attempt to block "morning after" pills, but SCOTUS stopped it - this time. I don't know what will happen when the religious right mounts another attempt to keep women barefoot and pregnant. I'm not a true Republican, though I favor Trump (slightly) over Biden. I'm more of a Libertarian, but not a chaotic one. That Libertarian stance, unfortunately, becomes hard to strictly define since a lot of the things I think should be legal are also considered a matter of conscience for many people. Too many regulations don't help this country.

 

[Thales750]

Sorry, Pat... my response was to Mike Krallo's #11 post that included a statement about abortion being in contention. Should have made it a formal reply instead of an informal one.

Pat, I hope you don't suddenly think I've bought into a progressive position. In this subject I have been consistent for many years. I happen to think I've bought into the idea that we have too many laws that restrict women's options, too many laws that sound too much like Sharia (Islamic) mandates... which I oppose most strenuously. And name-calling (by saying I've bought into a progressive's position) doesn't become you.

There was a recent attempt to block "morning after" pills, but SCOTUS stopped it - this time. I don't know what will happen when the religious right mounts another attempt to keep women barefoot and pregnant. I'm not a true Republican, though I favor Trump (slightly) over Biden. I'm more of a Libertarian, but not a chaotic one. That Libertarian stance, unfortunately, becomes hard to strictly define since a lot of the things I think should be legal are also considered a matter of conscience for many people. Too many regulations don't help this country.

You considerably more moderate than what Pat post. She has a relentless attack and continuous denial of anything except the ultra far right.

 

[Mike Krailo]

My #2 grandson was, in fact, an accident - but he is a beloved accident.

Thank God for that. I'm glad you have the joy to enjoy that new person in your family to the fullest.

Sorry, Pat... my response was to Mike Krallo's #11 post that included a statement about abortion being in contention. Should have made it a formal reply instead of an informal one.

If a state makes laws that says it's so, than it is the law. There is no sugar coating it. If a state says it's legal for a mother to abort, than that is the law in that state. The people have spoken in both cases. Choose your state.

 

[Pat Hartman]

You considerably more moderate than what Pat post. She has a relentless attack and continuous denial of anything except the ultra far right.

unnecessary personal attack. Why don't you justify your apparent position of "Abortion any time" because a fetus is not human and so has no rights since you think that my moderate position is "ultra far right".

@The_Doc_Man So, is Thales750 saying that my moderate position on abortion is "a relentless attack and continuous denial of anything except the ultra far right." Name-calling and "doesn't become him" Please be consistent in your judgments of others.

If a state makes laws that says it's so, than it is the law. There is no sugar coating it. If a state says it's legal for a mother to abort, than that is the law in that state. The people have spoken in both cases. Choose your state.

Unless you want anarchy, then I agree the law is the law. There are many laws I don't agree with. Doesn't mean that they can be ignored the way Biden does. The whole point of states rights is to give the states leeway to make laws that suit their residents. If you don't like the laws of your state, move. Or in the case of something like abortion, get in the car and cross the border to a different state. Late term abortions are problematic for a lot of reasons but early term abortions are not hard to come by.

Earlier Doc was talking about ra**. It's not like the woman doesn't know she was ra***. Why would she ever hesitate to make every effort to terminate a potential pregnancy that is obviously unwanted? Waiting until she knows she is pregnant before acting is simply crazy if you ask me and leads to exponentially more risk for the woman. A D&C (what they call an early state abortion) is not without risk and has the potential to damage the uterus and prevent further pregnancies. The morning after pill is far safer but must be taken immediately. At least by acting immediately, the act is more like actual birth control pills which the Catholic church still forbids as far as I know. Taking the morning after pill prevents the blastocyst from implanting (about 6 days after fertilization) and becoming an embryo. It is generally effective for up to 3-5 days after intercourse. The way the Democrats and Doc harp on the "ra**" issue when talking about abortion is just a red herring and is a way for the Democrats to attack Republicans who are generally more conservative on this issue given that they think that killing the baby after it is born is murder.

There are very few women who post here so I am essentially a solo voice. You men can argue all you want about abortion but your positions are all hypothetical since only women actually ever have this particular problem. YOU will never ever have to make the horrendous decision on whether or not to terminate a pregnancy unless you and your partner discover a serious problem with the mother or the fetus later in the pregnancy. I don't have statistics but I would guess that the abortion decision is largely a single women issue. Most married couples would choose to accept the gift of a child even when it is unplanned and inconvenient. Some married women in unhappy marriages would just have an abortion without consulting the father so you'll never even know if your wife had an abortion without even consulting you.

 

[Thales750]

unnecessary personal attack. Why don't you justify your apparent position of "Abortion any time" because a fetus is not human and so has no rights since you think that my moderate position is "ultra far right".

@The_Doc_Man So, is Thales750 saying that my moderate position on abortion is "a relentless attack and continuous denial of anything except the ultra far right." Name-calling and "doesn't become him" Please be consistent in your judgments of others.
consulting you.

How is it name calling, when I simply described your typical behavior. It's not a personal attack.
You are the most relentless True-Believer I have ever had a conversation with. Ever.

You should take that a s a compliment, and appreciate how astute my observations are.

 

[Pat Hartman]

You should take that a s a compliment, and appreciate how astute my observations are.

I would rather you opened your eyes and mind.

How about those campaign ads Joe has been running They sure got the reaction Joe was looking for. Too bad for them Trump turned his head at just the right moment. Do you care to comment on that "hate speech" or are you just going to devolve to more name calling? Please, please make my day. Just deny Joe's campaign ads are not hate speech.

 

[Isaac]

ABSOLUTELY!!!!!! Please reread the 1st Amendment and point out the exceptions for me since I cannot find any.

Even pornography is not inherently harmful or even dangerous. We do our best to protect our children from things they are too young to understand but beyond that, no adult has the right to choose what another adult as access to. You want to see "pornography" right out in plain sight, go to any bookstore or library and read a little of a "romance" novel. Some of it comes close to crossing the line between soft and hard core.

Hate speech is another story. It is emphasized by confirmation bias (look this up if you don't understand the concept and how dangerous it is). "Everybody hates Trump" so I'll do the world a favor and kill him. He is Hitler. Someone should have killed Hitler and saved millions of lives. This is how social media and Google (both inherently evil but no one is talking about stopping them) controls your feeds to give you more of what you "like". I have trained one of my feeds to give me nothing but articles about home decorating When I first discovered this problem about 20 years ago, to prove it to a friend, I trained a news feed to give me only articles about the British Royal Family.

But despite the evil brought into this world by Google and social media companies manipulating how you think, I would still not ban them. I would insist that the filtering criteria be made public and force them to allow you to change the filtering if you didn't like theirs.

Just knowing that you are being manipulated goes a long way toward mitigating the damage. You can force yourself to read other opinions even if the only way to do it is to find reliable conservative posters like Dennis Prager and Dave Rubin. Dennis has always been conservative and he is incredibly wise but Dave joined our ranks when he saw just how downright crazy and evil the progressives had made the Democrat party.

so you think if someone yelled "fire" in a crowded theater in the days of the founding fathers, they would have just smiled and said, "Ahh. Free speech at work", satisified with themselves as they watched the crowd stampede?

 

[Isaac]

Like the ones that protect our enviroment and make our houses safer?

Do you mean the ones that have financially ruined ranchers because a 2-inch stream of water (wetland) crossed their land, and make houses where I live cost $650k?
No, I wasn't referring to those.
Or Yes, I was - at about 1/4th the rate of what they have become, which according to the Democrats, is just "always more regulation"

 

[AccessBlaster]

Do you mean the ones that have financially ruined ranchers because a 2-inch stream of water (wetland) crossed their land, and make houses where I live cost $650k?
No, I wasn't referring to those.
Or Yes, I was - at about 1/4th the rate of what they have become, which according to the Democrats, is just "always more regulation"

@Isaac you're dealing with people who think cows are the problem. world.

 

[Thales750]

Do you mean the ones that have financially ruined ranchers because a 2-inch stream of water (wetland) crossed their land, and make houses where I live cost $650k?
No, I wasn't referring to those.
Or Yes, I was - at about 1/4th the rate of what they have become, which according to the Democrats, is just "always more regulation"

My career was in Home building and writing databases. I wrote databases for a wide variety of applications from building a document manger for the TSA to a Drug Rehab, construction project management, and an ERP for a Chemical Plant.
I've mention the Chemical Plants a few times, one, it literally transends 99.9% of database developer's capabilities, (so it feeds my ego). Second, I have a strong understanding of how regulations work, both from Construction and Oil and Gas.
In no way do regulations stifle these industries, and these are among the most regulated in the country.

Construction, in many ways, has the opposite of economy of scale, at least for the first several tipping points in growth. In super large construction projects the successful bidder has to have very deep pockets, so even if they are not as efficient, they still get the contracts.

Chemical Plants regulations have so little to do with the viability of the entity. A billion dollar a year plant might spend a million, maybe two on regulations administration, And capital improvements that include lower emissions and safer work environments are combined with energy savings and increased productivity, so they balance out.

The problem of agreeing with, and repeating, the talking points of over regulation is who they protect, and who pays for them. American, European, and Asian plants pump out huge profits in spite of all these regulations. Homebuilders, the same thing.

American home builders are not really effected by building codes, they are much more affected by interest rates and labor rates.

In both cases, regulations, which are primarily paid for by share holders, have little effect on everyday Americans, other than to make them safer.

 

[Thales750]

and make houses where I live cost $650k?

Very little to do with building codes, and much more to do with the successful California business environment. Austin when the same way, now people are leaving.
Demand made your homes expensive.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

So, is Thales750 saying that my moderate position on abortion is "a relentless attack and continuous denial of anything except the ultra far right." Name-calling and "doesn't become him" Please be consistent in your judgments of others.

I was trying to be a more moderate "immoderate moderator" by not calling him several unkind names. I am actually using some self-control to avoid using language at a level of ferocity that I feel might be warranted. Don't want to break Jon's brand new installation less than a month after he installed it, after all.

 

[Isaac]

successful California business environment

Now that's one I've never heard before.
I'm in AZ fyi

 

[Thales750]

Now that's one I've never heard before.
I'm in AZ fyi

That is exactly why people were moving to Austin. The supper high California pay checks led to super high real estate prices. Now Austin home prices are set to decline.
Texas has always had several advantages, most of which have nothing to do with our ideology.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

more to do with the successful California business environment

Would that be the environment that is causing many fast-food restaurants to close because they can't afford to pay the exorbitant minimum wage in that area?

 

[Thales750]

Would that be the environment that is causing many fast-food restaurants to close because they can't afford to pay the exorbitant minimum wage in that area?

The problem with fast food wage increases is systemic across the country. As we abandoned industrial jobs, we replaced them with entry level jobs. They don't provide living wages due to insufficient productivity. Forcing that has contributed to this inflatioary period. Not to worry though, they are being eliminated soon enough.
Within 5 years no new fastfood resturaunts will have employees. You'll see the rollout happening soon. It will sweep the country faster than the linier thinkers can blink their disbelief.
Most all of the old ways people cling to are coming to an end faster then they can imagine. Conservatives are going to be hit hardest, because their belief in pure capitalism is going to be proven wrong. Just like all those med addicted rust belt guys from the 90s. Project 2025 is merely another mechanism is this transition to a new human paradigm. I've known this was coming since I read I Robot in 1974.
What did the Borg Queen say?
Watch your futures end.
Interstate trucking
Assembly
Inexpensive housing
Farming and ranching
Doctors
Trash removal
House cleaning and laundry
Garment manufacturing
And then the rest.
There are already automation processes to end those jobs. That's not even counting the jobs that pure ai is coming for.
So cling to those old way, the tailors did, the coach builders did. It's done.
The whole world will be on substanance checks from taxes on profits, or there will be a massive die off of the human race.

 

[Thales750]

Now that's one I've never heard before.

Probably because it doesn't fit your world view. California has the 5th largest economy in the world

 

[AccessBlaster]

The problem with fast food wage increases is systemic across the country. As we abandoned industrial jobs, we replaced them with entry level jobs. They don't provide living wages due to insufficient productivity. Forcing that has contributed to this inflatioary period. Not to worry though, they are being eliminated soon enough.
Within 5 years no new fastfood resturaunts will have employees. You'll see the rollout happening soon. It will sweep the country faster than the linier thinkers

Duh, these are transitory jobs commonly utilized by highschoolers or college kids. These were never meant to provide a living wage for adults.
Silly liberals wreck everything they touch including fast food.