Gulf Oil Crisis

[Vassago]

Clinton was the best Pres. you've had since Roosevelt

Agreed! He had his personal issues obviously, but as a leader for leading the country into the 20th century (finally), he managed to know what he was doing. Unemployment was low and debt was gone. Then along comes Ol' Dubya to ruin it.

 

[GaryPanic]

Don't know the Ins and Outs of US politics but one point for Clinton is he left a budget surplus - I think??
If so, isn't this what the Republicans talk about but have not done for a while?

that may not be down to him -it could of just been the point in the marketing cycle -

look back every twenty or so years theres a high and a low point - and this cycles roughly every 6-8 years and its peaks and througs - you ahve 5 years at the bottom then 5 years climbimg up and 5 years at the top and then either a slide or a crash of 5 years ( I used 5 years but its between 5-8 years and different for differnt counties) when we are all inthe cycle and in sync - then there is trouble - we cannot all want and sell at the same time - someone must want stuff and have cash to buy it other countries make it and supply it then it rotates (well thats my take on it )

I ramble

 

[GaryPanic]

still clinton was very good -

maybe Hilary next time or is she still loathed by certain States ?- so got the contacts and the know how

 

[PNGBill]

Can't argue on the Cycle issue.
Then why did we Panic when the latest Cycle came around.

Makes me think of the child trying to stop the rising tide from destroying the sand castle.

Will we have paid off the debts from this cycle avoidance before the next cycle comes??

 

[ajetrumpet]

I ramble

we'd rather it be you than Rich or Colin.

 

[vbaInet]

According to BP's website, ownership is split as follows:
Institutions Individuals Total
UK 33% 7% 40%
US 25% 14% 39%
Rest of Europe 10% 0% 10%
Rest of World 7% 0% 7%
Miscellaneous 4% 0% 4%
Me 0% 0% 0%
------ ------- --------
79% 21% 100%

Source: http://www.bp.com/extendedsectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=9010453&contentId=7019612/memberId=vbaInet

The profits just keep rolling in

 

[PNGBill]

I know this is Nit Picking but Institutions allow for vague ownership.

Where do they get the Institution data from?

Say a Europe based Institution has 5% of BP but if 20% of that Institution is held by non Europe interests, will this show??

Nothing unnatural about this, just that how can we be sure of Ownership when dealing with such a big and International business.

This same concept allows someone to control a business when they don't own much of it.

Say you own 20% of a business and this business owns 20% of another, then your position in the 2nd business is strong and would out vote another person who only owned 19% of the 2nd business when in fact your 20% was only 20% paid for. (In a large business 20% could well make you the Chairman)
(This is where you get to strip the Pension Fund of business 2 and sell your interest before being caught and maybe get some Govt handouts to also take with you)

 

[Fifty2One]

I do not think the blame game will matter to your grandson or his children when they have a world with no nature left in it...

Only when the last tree has died
and the last river has been poisoned
and the last fish has been caught
will we realize
we cannot eat money.

The blame game for the other partners in this venture besides BP has retreated to courts. There is a move afoot to get the disaster treated under Admiralty law, which would limit TransOcean's liability to the cost of the rig. I think Haliburton is getting some flak, too.

As I understand it, the Exxon Valdez spill caused the U.S. Congress to specifically craft a law regarding oil spills and other similar types of polluting disasters. The new law says that when negligence can be proven, Admiralty law cannot be applied. Here, it will be easy to demonstrate negligence because worker testimony has already been taken to show that testing of certain safety measures was somehow bypassed. Evidence of gas bubbles in greater than normal quantity was also ignored. The hydraulic ram cutoffs didn't work. Those could have been tested, too. There was a bore-hole inspection that was not performed.

Blame? The U.S. Government is passing around blame for everyone except itself. The Minerals Management Service (MMS) is responsible for testing and documentation of that testing. This is a screw-up with corrupt government inspectors. A friend of mine worked on an offshore rig for a few years as their computer operator before coming to work with the Dept. of Defense. He said he had personally seen folks coming around with briefcases full of cash to pay of inspectors and safety officers. If so, then bribery and malfeasance in office should be added to the mix.

I grieve for the joys that my grandsons will not have with their father, going fishing with him as I did with my father. Fishing at the edge of the Gulf or in some of the inland waterways with Gulf access used to be a great bonding experience. Not to mention that there is nothing quite like really fresh fish when you grill or fry them. And it is bonding with Nature, too. That activity will probably not happen often again in my lifetime. I hope it can eventually happen in their lifetimes.

 

[Vassago]

I do not think the blame game will matter to your grandson or his children when they have a world with no nature left in it...

Only when the last tree has died
and the last river has been poisoned
and the last fish has been caught
will we realize
we cannot eat money.

We'll just eat Emu, they can survive through anything, reproduce like rabbits, are lean and good for you, and taste like beef.

 

[MrsGorilla]

We'll just eat Emu, they can survive through anything, reproduce like rabbits, are lean and good for you, and taste like beef.

Then why are we worrying about cleaning up the Gulf?

 

[Vassago]

Then why are we worrying about cleaning up the Gulf?

Americans are stubborn and won't adapt to emu. They'd rather eat their expensive and artery-clogging beef.

 

[boblarson]

Americans are stubborn and won't adapt to emu. They'd rather eat their expensive and artery-clogging beef.

Yep - beef, it's what's for dinner

 

[PNGBill]

We have cut down on our meat content. Stil have 99% of meals with meat but a lot less then we used to - feel much healthier now.
leaning more to Indian (India) style cooking with Suji and other dry goods used and plenty of spices.
Love Cajun cooking.
Food bill halved what it was 12 months ago.

Looking for 1800's Daniel Boone lifestyle with electricity, hotwater, DVD movies, modern health care and no utility bills, no Rates and Taxes.
Anyone hear of such a place, let me know.

 

[Pauldohert]

We have cut down on our meat content. Stil have 99% of meals with meat but a lot less then we used to - feel much healthier now.
leaning more to Indian (India) style cooking with Suji and other dry goods used and plenty of spices.
Love Cajun cooking.
Food bill halved what it was 12 months ago.

Looking for 1800's Daniel Boone lifestyle with electricity, hotwater, DVD movies, modern health care and no utility bills, no Rates and Taxes.
Anyone hear of such a place, let me know.

99% - wow. Does that include breakfast?

I would guess I'm more at 40% - 60% - thats outside of breakfast, which would be more like 5% at most with meat.

 

[Lightwave]

So regardless of how the oil manages to get out, it's out. And more is still coming out. There is so much of this stuff it'll be everywhere in time. If we think its bad now just wait until storms hit the gulf. Some areas could literally be dead forever.

It should be noted that stormy weather was credited with reducing the impact of the MV Braer Shetland oil disaster. It is argued that provided they can stop more from coming out storms may actually be good for getting rid of oil. Although Oil will not normally mix with water if you have enough water and something tumbling the stuff up even quite large amounts of oil will be sufficiently dispersed as not to remain such a long term problem quicker in stormy seas. All depends on exactly how much is coming out or if it is still coming out. I don't have first hand experience but I thought that apart from hurricanes the Carribean is a relatively calm place which may compound rather than reduce the possible effects of oil.

 

[PNGBill]

Pauldohert, Meat only included in one of the daily meals - as a rule
Our main meal is at mid day - easier to do when you work from home.