Online Programming (1 Viewer)

[Learn2010]

I have been using Access for over 25 years. I want to transfer these skills to online database management. That is, I want to be able to put the same types of databases on the web and manage them just like I do with Access.

I have tried different online courses but seem to hit a wall. Something is just not clicking in my brain. Each course seems to imply you already know something. I get confused there. I have taken some C#, a little SQL, and I know some of the VBA in Access. I have set up some phony web sites but have trouble with them.

So, maybe you guys can help me. I would like to start at the bottom again, and I mean at the very beginning. Assume I don't know anything. What do you guys suggest as to the first language I should learn?

Thank you.

 

[Uncle Gizmo]

I have been using Access for over 25 years. I want to transfer these skills to online database management. That is, I want to be able to put the same types of databases on the web and manage them just like I do with Access.

I have tried different online courses but seem to hit a wall. Something is just not clicking in my brain. Each course seems to imply you already know something. I get confused there. I have taken some C#, a little SQL, and I know some of the VBA in Access. I have set up some phony web sites but have trouble with them.

So, maybe you guys can help me. I would like to start at the bottom again, and I mean at the very beginning. Assume I don't know anything. What do you guys suggest as to the first language I should learn?

Thank you.

Have you considered Office 365 CRM... ? I'm working with a customer on developing a charity fund raising system with it. Not sure yet, it it is/will be powerful/flexible enough, but it looks promising.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[Learn2010]

My goal is to manage large databases.

 

[Uncle Gizmo]

Well I'm not sure you what you mean by large databases but if you're happy with MS Access, then I'm quite sure MySQL will be equal, possibly better. MySQL is the backbone of many websites like WordPress ones. So that's a possible route to get your data on the web so to speak!

To present the data on the internet then you're going to need something for building pages and linking those pages to the MySQL backend. I understand one of the best ways of doing this is with PHP, although I did read somewhere recently that PHP is a "cobbled together" programming language and has inherited some foibles of it's own...

I have never built a functioning MySQL based web database myself, although I have built a few WordPress based databases and I do feel quite comfortable with using MySQL and PHP indirectly through the agency of WordPress.

In preparation for the inevitable shift from MS Access to web based Solutions I did this course by Rob Tucker a few years back. I highly recommend it, it is absolutely brilliant. There is a later course, very similar, but this particular course by Rob has a lot going for it mainly because Rob has such a very nice way of speaking, a nice Cadence, he's very good to listen to.

You can view the course details here on the safari website:-
https://www.safaribooksonline.com/library/view/learning-php-mysql/9781926873114/

Safari books online still have a free offer of 10 days so you can sign up and watch the videos. If you manage to watch all the videos in 10 days then you get the course for free!

I think I saw the course somewhere else for free a while back. Can't remember! So that might be another way to get it, go search for "Learning PHP and MySQL" by Robert J Tucker

Details from the safari website:-
LEARNING PHP MySQL
18 REVIEWS
by Robert J. Tucker
Publisher: Infinite Skills
Release Date: August 2010
ISBN: 9781926873114
Running time: 10:43:15
Topic: PHP

 

[Learn2010]

Thank you, Sir. I will check that out.

 

[plog]

I want to be able to put the same types of databases on the web and manage them just like I do with Access

Can you be more specific? Databases are databases--SQL is the language of them. How does "the web" fit into this? Do you have a specific project in mind?

 

[Learn2010]

No. Just databases in general. I would like to be able to set up web sites so that I could manage the databases there. I now manage several Access databases in a medical setting but the need to leave the facility and access the data is growing. They are bringing in outside companies to do my job.

I have taken several courses including some html and css. I need to just start at the bottom and go through some things. Classes and variables seem to baffle me in how and where the structuring takes place. I have a mind block there for some reason. I figure that if I can start at the bottom I would be able to clear that up and fit that into my thinking. I also know that when I reach a certain point I will be able to move ahead quickly.

Any advice in that direction would help.

Thanks.

 

[plog]

No. Just databases in general. I would like to be able to set up web sites so that I could manage the databases there

Again, databases are databases, SQL is how you interact with them:
https://www.w3schools.com/sql/

Building webpages is another thing and that's what HTML is for. To make them look pretty you use CSS. To make them interactive you use JavaScript.

My suggestion is to get a specific project (build an online game, scrape data from a site and store it, etc.) and work towards making that come true.

 

[Learn2010]

Thank you for help. That gives me some direction.

 

[Learn2010]

Can you use C# instead of SQL?

 

[jdraw]

Learn2010,
Your question is quite open ended as others have mentioned.
If your interest is generally " large database dba", the here is a link that may help.

It might be helpful to readers and get you more focused responses if you could provide some examples of what you think you would like to be doing specifically if you were an "online programmer".

C# and SQL are different animals.

 

[Pat Hartman]

What platforms are the current developers using? Wouldn't it make sense for you to learn that?

 

[Learn2010]

In creating my own programs I have the freedom to do as I want. First, I would like to create databases that include employee data, patient data, demographics of both, tracking and billing for time involved in services provided to these people.

Another project is for marketing services that would allow interaction by the users, for a fee, for them to store, track, and report on their medical information.

From what I am seeing on these posts, it looks as though SQL, HTML, and CSS is a must. Can you add to this?

 

[jdraw]

Learn2010,

Sometimes the freedom to do anything results in nothing-- sometimes having a specific task/project with boundaries forces you to focus, plan, learn by doing. With 25+ years of Access use you must have experienced other systems or information and/or users with different applications. I would expect that some of these would raise your curiosity to investigate a little deeper. There is so much info on youtube etc you can get lists of IT related job descriptions; interviews with people in jobs/roles; system concepts; analysis and design approaches; specialized areas of IT; emerging technologies;..... A few minutes reviewing some of these subjects on youtube or reading articles should help you narrow down the area(s) of interest.
The online/web aspect of Access will be retired shortly.
As Tony said in post# 4, you may want to investigate PHP/MySQL and the "trial version" of the course.
I have a link to several other links re database planning and design and related topics --some of which may pique your interest.

Good luck with your searching.

 

[Learn2010]

Thank all you guys.

 

[NauticalGent]

Learn2010,
Your question is quite open ended as others have mentioned.
If your interest is generally " large database dba", the here is a link that may help.

Jack, thanks for posting this. My organization was forced to go to SQL Server and since no one in the IT department knows Access, it fell on me to make it happen.

Just to give you a clue as to what I have to deal with, here is a snippet of the conversation:

IT: (chuckling) “No ones uses Access anymore!”
Me: “Really? So what has taken its place?”
IT: “SharePoint!”
Me: “Great, so you’re telling me that there are qualified developers on the staff that can convert this Application to Sharepoint?”
IT: “Well, no...”

In the process of explaining to my bosses about the way ahead, I told them they need to establish a position that requires an SQL Server background, maybe even a DBA who also knows MS Office automation. Their response was “we have you”. I told them that I am not a DBA and it takes a little more than simply knowing how to make tables and such.

Long story short, they have offered to fund my education/certificate to become a DBA. Sounds great up front but I am unsure if this is what I want to do.

Is the juice worth the squeeze?

 

[jdraw]

NG,

There is one thing for sure--if you take any course no one can take that education from you. So, it's always something you have.

A lot of whether the "juice is worth the squeeze" depends on several things.
What is the organization's view on data management? Is there an "enterprise wide" approach to planning or is it silo vs silo?
If you are the one leading the charge to become more "corporate/enterprise" in approach, then be cautious. You need a "patron" who is skilled in the politics and has his/her own incentives for seeing it through.
Are there guidelines or standards for IT generally?

 

[Pat Hartman]

@NauticalGuy,
Being a DBA is quite different from being a Renaissance Man (I am a woman and I am not offended by this term) which is what you are currently. As an Access developer, you need to know it all. You need to be able to talk to the users to define their problem. You need application design skills to come up with a feasible solution. You need database design skills to create the correct schema, and finally, you need to be able to program to bring it to life. Why give all that up to be a DBA?

@Learn2010,
You seem to have bought into the current feeling that web development is good and client server development is bad. I came to Access from mainstream development back in the 90's before web apps took over and everyone had to program in some c variation or they were't real programmers. What I love about Access is that it is very good at what it does and I've never seen anything better. It is much maligned because people cannot separate it from Jet/ACE. All the criticisms you see are really targeted at Jet/ACE the database engines and actually have nothing to to with Access the RAD tool. It is true that MS has let us down over the years by never figuring out how to connect an Access application to a web database. They spent all their development efforts on re-imagining Access to run in a browser which wasn't what anyone was really asking for. What they wanted was a way to share DATA over the internet which is quite a different problem. Anyway, you are caught in a situation where the inmates are running the asylum so you have to either join them or leave. It's a bad place to be if you really want to stay.

I would pick one of your Access apps and target it for redevelopment. That gives you a firm target as others have said and I would use the tool that management has been hiring the new people to use. That will make you the most useful to your current employer.

 

[NauticalGent]

First off, Learn2010, I apologize for hijacking this thread. You seem to have gotten your answer so unless you object, I will continue making this thread about me...

There is one thing for sure--if you take any course no one can take that education from you. So, it's always something you have.

Absolutely, which is why I will probably go down that rabbit-hole as long as I do not have to obtain a degree in CS. I took me FOREVER to get my BS (and a whole lot of it) in Tech Management and I do not want to take a bunch of courses that I will not use again. If there is some sort of certificate that streamlines the process, trims the fat and leaves the white-meat then I am all for it.

If you are the one leading the charge to become more "corporate/enterprise" in approach, then be cautious. You need a "patron" who is skilled in the politics and has his/her own incentives for seeing it through.
Are there guidelines or standards for IT generally?

Good advice in general but hard to apply in my situation. Hopefully Doc will see this and provide a more detailed explanation, after all he was once part of the bureaucratic empire that I am about to slander...

The over-arching guidelines start with the Defense Information Systems Agency, works its way to the individual services, in my case Navy. Works its way to the appropriate Systems Commands and in my case to Naval Computer and Telecommunications Station (NCTS) and from there to the individual activities' N6 (IT) department.

I am an auxiliary member of the N6 only because I am the only one who is not afraid of Access and has a Secret Clearance. In other words, any specific guidelines will be established by me as long as I do not violate the long-line of standing guidance from above.

When it comes to individual application like mine, I pretty much have the run of the place because I am restricted to the Region (NCTS). Big Navy only really gets big brother-ish with official Program Of Record applications which this is not.

The individual who was tasked with establishing an instance on SQL Server had no idea on how to migrate Access tables. I watched a series of videos by Steve Bishop and when I was ready, he installed SSMS on my machine and walked away. The group level DSN, migration process and follow-on Maintenance Plan all fell on me to put in place. Thanks God for Youtube and Dr. Google.

Anyway, that's my story and this all stemmed from an earlier thread when I was concerned about "upgrading" from Win7/Office 2010 to Win10/Office 2013.

The whole experience almost made me wish I had stayed with Truck-Driving but then I would not have been given the handle "Nautical Gent".

Thanks again for the links, it was extremely timely and on point.

 

[NauticalGent]

Well Pat, here I was thinking I was nothing but an Access hack in need a some Cert to validate my existence and you have turned me into a Renaissance Man - heads and shoulders above a lowly DBA.

If you ever get tired of being a developer, you may find a niche being an Access Therapist...!