The Qur'an (6 Viewers)

[conception_native_0123]

By the way, how many different ways to spell the Q'uran are there ??

ya know Isaac, since it doesn't mean anything to me, I never considered finding out. Do you want to know? I COULD put some effort in for a stand-up guy like you.

 

[pbaldy]

pbaldy forgive me please in advance

You got it.

I unsubscribed after Adam answered and will again after posting this, so forgive me for that.

I probably fall into the "spiritual but not religious" camp. I don't believe any of the books are "divine", they're written by people trying to understand the unknowable. I simply try to live my life by treating others the way I wish to be treated. I don't criticize others for believing otherwise. If believing gives them peace, great.

 

[Isaac]

You got it.

I unsubscribed after Adam answered and will again after posting this, so forgive me for that.

I probably fall into the "spiritual but not religious" camp. I don't believe any of the books are "divine", they're written by people trying to understand the unknowable. I simply try to live my life by treating others the way I wish to be treated. I don't criticize others for believing otherwise. If believing gives them peace, great.

Fair enough!Fair enough!

 

[Isaac]

ya know Isaac, since it doesn't mean anything to me, I never considered finding out. Do you want to know? I COULD put some effort in for a stand-up guy like you.

Yes please do. I think maybe three or four

 

[The_Doc_Man]

The problem with figuring out the correct spelling of the Quran is that we REALLY are looking for the correct transliteration of the title "Quran." And it is published in many different Aramaic-rooted languages, which means the transliteration rules differ from one language to the next. Further complicated by some of those languages having multi-valued letter equivalents.

I'm content with the fact that when I wrote "Quran" that Aziz didn't accuse me of maliciously misspelling the name.

 

[Galaxiom]

The problem with figuring out the correct spelling of the Quran is that we REALLY are looking for the correct transliteration of the title "Quran."

Plus there are multiple versions of Arabic with variations on whether short sounds are written. These differences may be carried over and the short sounds are sometimes left out in the translations too. I think maybe that is why apostrophes are used a lot.

 

[Isaac]

Wow you guys know a lot about Arabic. I'm glad I asked, learned something new

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Part of the problem also includes that ancient Hebrew and other languages from that part of the world didn't always include vowel sounds. When you look at a Hebrew type font, you are looking at mostly consonants. Vowel sounds in ancient Hebrew were sometimes omitted as a form of code. When vowel sounds were included, they were written as diacritical marks over or under the letters. AND some consonants have variant pronunciations as well.

From Quora: Modern Hebrew does have vowels, but they are not always represented as distinct letters in the written language. In traditional Hebrew script, only the consonants are represented, while the vowels are indicated by diacritical marks called "nikkud." However, in everyday writing, these vowel markings are often omitted, and readers rely on context and familiarity with the language to supply the vowel sounds. This is similar to other Semitic languages like Arabic, where the consonantal script is used with diacritics to indicate vowels.

 

[Isaac]

Brain Freeze alert, that's a lot of 5 dollar words to learn.

Sounds like a hard language to learn. (English is among the hard languages to learn - I've finally conceded after having dozens and dozens of foreigners assure me of that - its low adherence rate to Rules compared with languages like Spanish makes it require enormous amounts of memorization other languages don't........And the incredibly slight, so slight as to be unnoticeable to more foreigners' ears, vowel differences, are laughable to them and I can see their point.)

 

[The_Doc_Man]

@Isaac
This is beginning to deviate from the thread, though some of us apparently believe Aziz has beat this horse to death already.

However, the problem with English and those subtle vowel differences is that our English language has a LOT of borrowed words that come from many different source languages. THEN on top of that, we have regional pronunciations. Compare, for example, the accents of Boston and Kansas City and Dallas and Lafayette (Louisiana). THEN add to that the presence of cultural variations such as inner city dialects vs. rural dialects vs. downtown accents. I'm surprised we USA citizens can understand each other from more than about five states away.

 

[aziz rasul]

No, I categorically did not.

You indicated that the knowledge (that is microscopic in nature) was known at the time due to animal husbandry, so you are the one who is disingenuous and LYING. Please STOP LYING.

 

[aziz rasul]

Not sure I can even comment

Well when you have a FALSE belief which makes a Prophet a God, then as a believers, we Muslims need to point this out.

 

[aziz rasul]

A semantic difference only.

It's NOT semantics, although you want it to be that way as it suits your narrative.

 

[aziz rasul]

The "Word of God* written

The sister is correct in what she is saying. The other person is playing games. Who put the words on paper is immaterial. The words themselves are the speech of God, just as the earlier Scriptures were.

The Qur'an is the word of God passed to Gabriel (peace be upon him) who then passed it on to Muhammad (peace be upon him) who then passed it to one of his many scribes who transferred it to whatever material was available.

The man in the video is simply playing games and only the gullible get taken in so easily

 

[Galaxiom]

The words themselves are the speech of God, just as the earlier Scriptures were.

All the scriptures are nothing more sophisticated than the personal prejudices of the delusional people who imagined their hallucinations were communications from a supernatural being. In short, these people were mentally ill.

Every year at Ramadan, Muslims try to recreate the mental illness in themselves through dehydration.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

You indicated that the knowledge (that is microscopic in nature) was known at the time due to animal husbandry, so you are the one who is disingenuous and LYING. Please STOP LYING.

Since I am an involved party in this discussion, I must at this point disqualify myself as being the moderator who would take punitive action against another member. It would be unethical of me to do that since I am the aggrieved party. However, Aziz, please understand that false accusations can be considered abusive and this entire thread could be removed because of it.

You are the one who claims ancient knowledge of something that you believe requires microscopic apparatus, but I have merely pointed out that you don't need a microscope in those cases. A drop of any aqueous or organic fluid can be large enough to be seen with the naked eye. What is IN the drop? Maybe not - but your quote line says a "drop." As to a woman's discharge, a clot big enough to see is no problem. Heck, when I get a nosebleed, the clot that comes out is quite obvious to the naked eye. Blood does that, you know.

I am fairly certain that I never said anyone had - or needed - a microscope to see a drop or a clot. I'm not lying about what I said or didn't say and I strongly feel that I am right. However, you are clearly either misunderstanding my point OR you are deflecting from it because you so desperately want your assertion to be true.

 

[Galaxiom]

However, Aziz, please understand that false accusations can be considered abusive and this entire thread could be removed because of it.

I came very close to warning Aziz for the same post.

 

[Jon]

You indicated that the knowledge (that is microscopic in nature) was known at the time due to animal husbandry, so you are the one who is disingenuous and LYING. Please STOP LYING.

I'm locking this thread because tempers are rising and the above post is getting abusive. I may unlock it at some future date.

 

[Isaac]

Frankly, Galaxiom's posts were far more abusive than Aziz's. It is more abusive to repeatedly call someone 'stupidity' or 'stupid' than it is to say 'stop lying'. But we would hate to admit a so-called, self-titled "super-moderator" was being abusive

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Frankly, Galaxiom's posts were far more abusive than Aziz's. It is more abusive to repeatedly call someone 'stupidity' or 'stupid' than it is to say 'stop lying'. But we would hate to admit a so-called, self-titled "super-moderator" was being abusive

@Isaac - there is the possibility that what Galaxiom said about the authors of Islamic scripture would also apply to the writers of other scripture as well. I wonder, therefore, if your response includes an element of reacting to a comment that COULD equally apply to the Bible. However, you ARE correct that we should try to avoid name-calling.