Atheists and theists are the same.

[Alisa]

But if the atheist says he does not know 100% that God does not exist, then he has entered a position of faith. Richard Dawkins explains this quite well.

I think you meant if the atheist says he DOES know 100% . . .
In any case, nobody is saying that. You can say you don't think god exists without saying you are 100% sure about it.

 

[Mike375]

I think you meant if the atheist says he DOES know 100% . . .
In any case, nobody is saying that. You can say you don't think god exists without saying you are 100% sure about it.

If the atheist is not 100% sure there is no god or God then they enter a position of faith.

Kind of like....of the evidence available I believe there is no god or God. That would seem to be a perfectly natural posotion for the atheist.

Alisa, is it your belief there is no god or God or do you have proof that eliminates "belief"

 

[Alisa]

What if I said to you, Mike, there is a purple planet orbiting our sun. And then you checked the news, and saw no reports of any such discovery. What would you say to me?

 

[Mike375]

What if I said to you, Mike, there is a purple planet orbiting our sun. And then you checked the news, and saw no reports of any such discovery. What would you say to me?

Alisa, this is a simple question for you...is it your belief there is no god or God or do you have proof that eliminates "belief"

Answer to your question....I checked the news reports Alisa and there was nothing about the purple planet orbiting our sun. Where did you get that information from.

 

[Alisa]

Alisa, this is a simple question for you...is it your belief there is no god or God or do you have proof that eliminates "belief"

Answer to your question....I checked the news reports Alisa and there was nothing about the purple planet orbiting our sun. Where did you get that information from.

So is it fair to say that you don't believe there is a purple planet orbiting our sun?

 

[Mike375]

So is it fair to say that you don't believe there is a purple planet orbiting our sun?

It would depend on your answer to the second part of my answer.

"Answer to your question....I checked the news reports Alisa and there was nothing about the purple planet orbiting our sun. Where did you get that information from."

And Alisa, surely this question is not too hard...is it your belief there is no god or God or do you have proof that eliminates "belief"

 

[Alisa]

It would depend on your answer to the second part of my answer.

"Answer to your question....I checked the news reports Alisa and there was nothing about the purple planet orbiting our sun. Where did you get that information from."

And Alisa, surely this question is not too hard...is it your belief there is no god or God or do you have proof that eliminates "belief"

I read it in a book that was published 2000 years ago, and it says right there in the book that the planet exists, and also that everything in the book is true.

 

[Mike375]

I read it in a book that was published 2000 years ago, and it says right there in the book that the planet exists, and also that everything in the book is true.

Alisa, comeon, this an easy question for you...is it your belief there is no god or God or do you have proof that eliminates "belief"

But back to your question's extension.

Well, first I would ask you are you referring to the Bible. I assume that is the case. If so I would tell you that I am not a literal Bible believer. However, if it was the Bible I would ask you for the reference so I could show it to a Bible person to see if your reading was correct and probably refer you to that person.

But in summary, if I could not find any evidence of the purple planet and given it is supposedly a local planet, then an entry in the Bible would not make me believe the purple planet was orbiting our sun.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

In the Religion and Spirituality section of the Yahoo Answers site, this battle rages on incessantly.

The issue will always be in flux because belief is what it is. Belief is a mindset or opinion strong enough on which to base one's actions, often independent of any proof of that belief. Both faith (belief without proof) and scientific assertion (belief based on something physical) are forms of belief. I had the misfortune to try to debate a friend whose Ph.D. was in Philosophy, and her dissertation was on the subject of Belief. She asked the question of whether one could attribute the concept of BELIEF to lesser animals. Talk about hearing more than I wanted to hear on a subject... but I digress.

All I can contribute to this situation is that believers and non-believers don't even think alike because they refuse to agree on terms. (At least, that's what I see in the Yahoo Answers section.)

When an atheist demands proof, that is hedging the bet because we already know that proof will not be forthcoming based on what the Bible itself tells us.

The problem is that the faithful place their belief in a 2000-year-old book for which all witnesses to the events therein are now dead and corroboration by interrogating witnesses is impossible. The miraculous events reported in the Bible cannot be proven scientifically without some equivocation or mundane explanation.

I tend to believe that there is no God simply because God's existence defies all logic. I.e. why in all of creation would a perfect being want to create such imperfect beings as we are? I also have problems in that the God depicted in the Bible is petty, childish, vain, cruel, unforgiving (despite assurances to the contrary), and likes to vacillate. All of which are HUMAN conditions pointing to God as being the creation of human authors. If God were to divinely inspire the Bible, one would hope he would depict himself in a far better light. But if those were all just stories made up with the same validity as, say, the Norse or Roman mythologies, it all makes sense. Those gods were also imbued with too many human attributes.

I do not begrudge anyone their beliefs. The above is not an argument that should be taken as trying to convice someone of God's existence or non-existence. The above summarizes why I believe that God is a myth.

 

[Mike375]

I tend to believe that there is no God simply because God's existence defies all logic. I.e. why in all of creation would a perfect being want to create such imperfect beings as we are?

Doc, the Biblical end of town answer that with we were perfect until Adam sinned.

Of course that creates the problem of "why would an all knowing God create something that he He knew would sin". But the "born again" will counter that we can't be expected to understand or know the reasons for the actions of God.

In my opinion the biggest hurdle for any "religion" is the issue of being saved. God knows what we will do and so we can't change the outcome. If we could change the outcome then God did not know what we would do

 

[Mike375]

If one starts on the basis that the Bible is like other histiory books, that is, elements of truth and the basic story is correct, then the Bible suggests God is a supernatural but of limited power.

As a side note, the Bible is written by lots of people over a long period of time. If we compiled a single book that took all the information written on dinosaurs since they were discovered, then that would be a book with some serious contradictions.

 

[Rabbie]

If one starts on the basis that the Bible is like other histiory books, that is, elements of truth and the basic story is correct, then the Bible suggests God is a supernatural but of limited power.

Then why do so many Christians and Muslims believe that God is all-powerful?

As a side note, the Bible is written by lots of people over a long period of time. If we compiled a single book that took all the information written on dinosaurs since they were discovered, then that would be a book with some serious contradictions.

But the book on dinosaurs would not claim to be the word of an all-powerful, all-knowing deity.

 

[Mike375]

Then why do so many Christians and Muslims believe that God is all-powerful?

Don't know about the Islamers but certainly many Christians only have a shallow belief of the Bible and have not examined it. But if the Bible is correct even at only the basic levels then it indicates a god of limited power. I think God is a branch manager.

But the book on dinosaurs would not claim to be the word of an all-powerful, all-knowing deity.

That does not matter as it was written by people. Being inspired by God is not the same as written by God. But the simple facts are people do not say paleontology is all bullshit and of course the reason is that not all writings have been assembled in one book.

As a side note I have seen the list a few times that answers Bible contradictions. As I remember several of them can be answered just by variations of how an observation can be stated. There is one thing I can guarantee and that is a well versed "born again" will have an answer to any objection.

I was watching a video of Richard Dawkins today and he looks and sounds like Tony Blair. Might be the accent.

 

[Mike375]

Alisa,

How are you going with that simple little question....is it your belief there is no god or God or do you have proof that eliminates "belief"

 

[Mike375]

I am watching Close Encounters of the Third Kind and that is followed by the original The War of the Worlds. I should be feeling quite spiritual by the time I go to bed

 

[Alisa]

Alisa, comeon, this an easy question for you...is it your belief there is no god or God or do you have proof that eliminates "belief"

But back to your question's extension.

Well, first I would ask you are you referring to the Bible. I assume that is the case. If so I would tell you that I am not a literal Bible believer. However, if it was the Bible I would ask you for the reference so I could show it to a Bible person to see if your reading was correct and probably refer you to that person.

But in summary, if I could not find any evidence of the purple planet and given it is supposedly a local planet, then an entry in the Bible would not make me believe the purple planet was orbiting our sun.

So is it fair to say that you don't believe it?

 

[Mike375]

So is it fair to say that you don't believe it?

I am inclined to believe the basics of the Bible are correct. By the basics, I mean at some time a supernatural was doing a few miracles and about 2000 years ago there was a bloke called Jesus about the place and he did a few miracles but smaller ones

I find it extremely difficult to believe the Bible is all fairy tales.

Put it this way. I have been keen on dinosaurs for close to 50 years and a lot has changed in what is read. However, what is constant is that a long time ago there were reptile like animals that were much larger in average size than occurs today.

George Armstrong Custer and the Battle of the Little Big Horn has gone from a Custer's Last Stand to half of them froze on the spot and the other half ran for their lives. But what remains constant is Custers men were massacred by the Indians.

How are you making out with my simple little question to you....is it your belief there is no god or God or do you have proof that eliminates "belief"

 

[Alisa]

No, I meant, is it fair to say you don't believe my story about the purple planet?

 

[Mike375]

No, I meant, is it fair to say you don't believe my story about the purple planet?

This is what I said

But in summary, if I could not find any evidence of the purple planet and given it is supposedly a local planet, then an entry in the Bible would not make me believe the purple planet was orbiting our sun.

 

[Alisa]

"In summary" then, which statement best represents your view:

I believe the purple planet story.

I do not believe the purple planet story.