Ukraine

[Steve R.]

The Ukraine leader has been calling for a no-fly zone, article 5 might be implemented in different ways.

My understanding is that Article 5 would be implemented only when a country in the NATO alliance is attacked. Ukraine is not part of NATO, so Article 5 would not apply.

I still don't understand why the USA is foot-dragging on this issue, maybe those based in the USA can enlighten us.

Some in the US find the "foot-dragging" incomprehensible. In the absence of rationality, it would be difficult to "enlighten us".
The only words of "enlightenment", I can offer; publicly the Biden administration has to pretend stand-up for the Ukraine. But in private they have no interest in supporting the Ukraine. Like religious zealots, they are ideologically consumed towards implementing the "green new deal". They view the Ukraine as a "distraction" to be dismissed.

 

[oleronesoftwares]

My understanding is that Article 5 would be implemented only when a country in the NATO alliance is attacked. Ukraine is not part of NATO, so Article 5 would not apply

Yes you are correct, so Russia wants to stop Ukraine from joining NATO?

 

[Steve R.]

Yes you are correct, so Russia wants to stop Ukraine from joining NATO?

NATO has been expanding eastward after the demise of the Soviet Union. Putin was getting upset, just like the US would if Russian troops were sent to Cuba. Unfortunately, Biden/Harris made provocative statements to the effect that if the Ukraine wanted to be in NATO that that was Ukraine's right and Russia had no right to interfere. Putin, it would seem, viewed this potential expansion of NATO further to the east as the proverbial last-straw so he invaded the Ukraine.

 

[AccessBlaster]

Back when Kamala Harris was arm candy for Montel Williams Nato and the Clinton's were pushing eastward expansion. So why are people surprised?

 

[AccessBlaster]

The military industrial complex is running the show, everything else is just static.

 

[Steve R.]

the Clinton's were pushing eastward expansion. So why are people surprised?

Since the Clinton's came-up. The demise of Muammar Gaddafi was an apparent Hillary Clinton "hit job". Bill Clinton, took the side of Muslims in Bosnia by launching cruise missiles into Serbian held areas of Bosnia. (Perhaps the first example of Democrats using the official power of the US to openly supporting Muslims.)

Since Bill Clinton interfered in Bosnia/Serbia, can a case be contrived that the US could legitimately interfere in a Ukrainian/Russian dispute?
(Of course Bosnia/Serbia was a situation where the US was the powerful bully that could push these smaller countries around. That is not the case with Russia,)
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Since posting, I did some internet searching. Unbelievably NATO was involved in attacking Gaddafi. That is unbelievable as NATO is supposed to be a defensive organization to protect Europe. Libya is in Africa.

2011 military intervention in Libya - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

On 19 March 2011, a multi-state NATO-led coalition began a military intervention in Libya, to implement United Nations Security Council Resolution 1973, in response to events during the First Libyan Civil War. With ten votes in favour and five abstentions, the UN Security Council's intent was to have "an immediate ceasefire in Libya, including an end to the current attacks against civilians, which it said might constitute “crimes against humanity” ... [imposing] a ban on all flights in the country's airspace — a no-fly zone — and tightened sanctions on the [Muammar] Qadhafi regime and its supporters."

 

[Steve R.]

@Pat Hartman: You posted, while I was making an edit. Evidently, in the case of Lyba, the UN did sanction a NATO attack. Seems like the UN could "defend" the Ukraine. The problem of course is that Russia and China have veto power in the UN.

2011 military intervention in Libya - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[AngelSpeaks]

Am I the only one who sees a problem here? We also sit on the security council. Can we invade Canada with impunity?

Unfortunately any member of the permanent security council can get away with anything. The rule that all five members must agree is beyond stupid. There are ten members of the non permanent security council. How about if ten members agree, a resolution passes?

 

[AngelSpeaks]

Is the presence of a VP not a strong representation of a Government?

She's an embarrassment. So to answer your question, no.

 

[AccessBlaster]

Was Kuwait a NATO member in 1990? I think we all know the answer.

 

[oleronesoftwares]

I don't believe that the Ukrainians should be abandoned to deal alone with the Russians. Where the hell is the UN? Isn't the UN supposed to stop this type of aggression? Why is the UN allowing Russia to get away with invading another sovereign country?

The whole idea of the UN does not favor most countries, if most countries of the world were better governed and advanced, UN ideology won't sell far.

 

[oleronesoftwares]

She's an embarrassment. So to answer your question, no.

If she is, then the same thing applies to her boss.

 

[oleronesoftwares]

The rule that all five members must agree is beyond stupid

How can the UN be united, when its security council is polarised. Russia and China VS the rest.

 

[oleronesoftwares]

f only she were not a complete moron. When you ask her a question she has no answer for she cracks up hysterically. It is funny to watch and the interviewer usually joins in, but really sad. She is a heartbeat away from the presidency and she is completely clueless.

Hmm, that is soo sad, because in the future reference will be made that the first female VP was clueless.

 

[oleronesoftwares]

Unfortunately, Biden/Harris made provocative statements to the effect that if the Ukraine wanted to be in NATO that that was Ukraine's right and Russia had no right to interfere

This might be what triggered the War because Putin knows that the USA will not allow such if they were in the shoes of Russia.

 

[AccessBlaster]

"Biden to announce Friday that US will move to revoke 'most favored nation' status for Russia"

They haven't done this yet? Wow.

 

[Cotswold]

You may not believe this but apparently there are people in Australia and the USA who think Ukraine is a hoax. A bit like the flat earth brigade.

 

[AngelSpeaks]

If she is, then the same thing applies to her boss.

Absolutely!

 

[AngelSpeaks]

Hmm, that is soo sad, because in the future reference will be made that the first female VP was clueless.

She's an embarrassment to the Women's Movement.

 

[AngelSpeaks]

How can the UN be united, when its security council is polarised. Russia and China VS the rest.

That's why the UN is impotent. This is why GWB went after Iraq. The UN wouldn't do it.