Lets Stop George Bush before he Destroys the Whole Planet Earth.

[KenHigg]

Well you see Richie old boy, it's like this...

Most all of your 'stuff' eventually morphs into a I hate America thingie. I don't think you always intend it to go there when you start, but you just don't know when to shut up and it's kind of lame...

All to often when your argument appears to be faltering, you pick some brain-dead tangent to veer off on and if you see the hate stuff on the horizon, then off you go...

If you feel my assessment erroneous, I challenge you to leave the 'hate you' stuff at home for a week and see if you can sustain any kind of debate with Kraj...

 

[Rich]

Well you see Richie old boy, it's like this...

Most all of your 'stuff' eventually morphs into a I hate America thingie. I don't think you always intend it to go there when you start, but you just don't know when to shut up and it's kind of lame...

All to often when your argument appears to be faltering, you pick some brain-dead tangent to veer off on and if you see the hate stuff on the horizon, then off you go...

If you feel my assessment erroneous, I challenge you to leave the 'hate you' stuff at home for a week and see if you can sustain any kind of debate with Kraj...

I've given enough examples that the "land of the free" is a myth, do you need more?
Oh and most of your stuff is simply "America the great", I know it's a shock for you but you're not, remind me why bringing Gitmo into a thread on an American "all men are free" thread is a tangent?
Oh and by the way I don't hate anybody, I can't, I'm not American to start with

 

[KenHigg]

I've given enough examples that the "land of the free" is a myth, do you need more?
Oh and most of your stuff is simply "America the great", I know it's a shock for you but you're not, remind me why bringing Gitmo into a thread on an American "all men are free" thread is a tangent?
Oh and by the way I don't hate anybody, I can't, I'm not American to start with

I thought were were going to be affraid to take the challenge

Rich - Debate without hate - No

Winner = Kraj

 

[Kraj]

I've given enough examples that the "land of the free" is a myth, do you need more?

argumentum ad naseum
The incorrect belief that an assertion is more likely to be true the more often it is heard. An "argumentum ad naseum" is one that employs constant repitition in asserting a concept.

Oh and most of your stuff is simply "America the great", I know it's a shock for you but you're not, remind me why bringing Gitmo into a thread on an American "all men are free" thread is a tangent?

Argumentum ad hominem
An argument that attempts to disprove the truth of what is asserted by attacking the speaker rather than the speaker's argument. Another way of putting it: fallacy where you attack someone's character instead of dealing with salient issues. There are two basic types of ad hominem arguments: 1) abusive and 2) circumstantial.
abusive: the person is attacked over what he said
example:
Arguing with Hitler over whether the sun is shining, just because it's Hitler.
circumstantial: attacking the circumstances the person is in
example:
Don't listen to the congressman; he's pro-union.

Oh and by the way I don't hate anybody, I can't, I'm not American to start with

Converse accident
Hasty generalization. An argument in which a proposition is used as a premise without attention given to some obvious condition that would affect the proposition's application. It is a fallacy that takes evidence from several, possibly unrepresentative, cases to a general rule; generalizing from few to many.

That was fun.

 

[KenHigg]

That was fun.

Yes it was - Thanks

 

[Rich]

That was fun.

Ask the Negros of America if they agree with you

 

[Rich]

That was fun.

Ask the Negros of America if they agree with you

 

[Rich]

That was fun.

Ask the Negros of America if they agree with you

 

[Kraj]

Ask the Negros of America if they agree with you

I wait with baited breath for the sure-fire hilarity that will ensue when you explain what on Earth that is supposed to mean.

 

[Rich]

I wait with baited breath for the sure-fire hilarity that will ensue when you explain what on Earth that is supposed to mean.

See if you can figure it out for yourself, or do you dismiss them as a valid argument against the term "America is the land of the free and all men are equal"?

 

[Rich]

The suspected criminal cannot be denied his right to a fair trial even if a majority of the citizenry demands otherwise.

What a pity that doesn't extend to America's attitude to the rest of the world, oops, silly me, that's not a valid argument, well not in an American's eyes that is

 

[Kraj]

So at what point did you decide that a discussion about whether an essay has value despite containing a few heaviliy biased statements is really about whether "America is the land of the free and all men are equal"?

 

[Rich]

So at what point did you decide that a discussion about whether an essay has value despite containing a few heaviliy biased statements is really about whether "America is the land of the free and all men are equal"?

Because like I said, it was written soley for an American audience, that puts it up for challenge.
The so called freedoms don't exist for all and never have, some are more equal than others, allways have been and always will

 

[jsanders]

Because like I said, it was written soley for an American audience, that puts it up for challenge.
The so called freedoms don't exist for all and never have, some are more equal than others, allways have been and always will

Ignorence is bliss ay Richy Boy?

No wonder we were successful in running you off our land.

 

[KenHigg]

Because like I said, it was written soley for an American audience, that puts it up for challenge.
The so called freedoms don't exist for all and never have, some are more equal than others, allways have been and always will

Don't get me wrong Rich, I'm not by no means saying all your assertions are invalid. In fact, I would probably agree with most of them if you could keep them within the content of a topic...

 

[Rich]

No wonder we were successful in running you off our land.

We left, after all who the hell wants to stay in a land of smugglers where so called freedom is supposedly enshrined on a scrap of meaningless paper for display to masses whilst in reality protecting capitalism
Remind me again, who's ignorant ?

 

[Rich]

Don't get me wrong Rich, I'm not by no means saying all your assertions are invalid. In fact, I would probably agree with most of them if you could keep them within the content of a topic...

I did Kenny, we were discussing freedom and the United States, in case you're unsure, Gitmo is run by the United States, you know that's where men with funny looking skin are locked up without trial, without access to the outside world, without being convicted of anything, all men are equal?
Now you tell me were you think I strayed off topic ?

 

[KenHigg]

We left, after all who the hell wants to stay in a land of smugglers where so called freedom is supposedly enshrined on a scrap of meaningless paper for display to masses whilst in reality protecting capitalism
Remind me again, who's ignorant ?

I think the display is kind of a symbolic thing (?)

We done got under your skin big time today haven't we...

Sorry... I'll try to be a bit more nice

 

[Rich]

I think the display is kind of a symbolic thing (?)

We done got under your skin big time today haven't we...

Sorry... I'll try to be a bit more nice

You know one of my best friends at college was an American, one of the nicest people I've ever met. Never preached, never wanted to go and fight in some foreign unjust war, never got into an argument, just wanted to enjoy his life and have a good time. I often wonder what happened to Jess and America

 

[KenHigg]

I did Kenny, we were discussing freedom and the United States, in case you're unsure, Gitmo is run by the United States, you know that's where men with funny looking skin are locked up without trial, without access to the outside world, without being convicted of anything, all men are equal?
Now you tell me were you think I strayed off topic ?

I'm quite aware of Gitmo, thanks. It is a bad situation for all involved not just the one's that are locked up. On the upside, I'm guessing outside what I would have to guess is the over-sensationalized bad treatment some of them get, it's probably a better idea to keep suspected war criminals in a location that isn't so geographically risky...

Of course I realize your desire may be to call into question the root cause of the situation and maybe not Gitmo in particular. ? In which case why don't we just cut to the chase ...